Tricksy "Colour" Brown
Now, a lot of us must remember the rainbow song from our youth (yes I can sing a rainbow with the best of them)... and although this doesn't really line up with standard Red, Orange, Yellow, Green, Blue, Indigo, Violet that we have decided to divide visible light into... It recently became apparent to me, that neither the rainbow song or ROYGBIV lets the colour brown stand with its own dignity. This comes as a huge blow to me as I was always under the impression that I had been wearing shades of brown... but as it turns out... my proudly bland wardrobe is actually full of reds, oranges and yellows! Can any one think of another colour treated in such a harsh way?
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"Roy G Biv" is a primitive mnemonic used to map specific wavelength bands onto colors generally recognized in western culture. Since human color recognition is not based on wavelength (see, for example, Land's experiments in color constancy and Helmholtz' "discounting the illuminant), that mapping is necessarily incomplete.
Color is subjective, if wavelength bands are named as colors then human color recognition is tied to wavelength.
Yes?
L
No. Human color names are typically associated with wavelengths present during white-light illumination of typical "natural" scenes. But that association is not required for color perception.
As Land's experiments showed, is it possible for normal humans to perceive (that is, to reliably and reproducibly report) a particular color when none of the wavelengths associated with that color are actual present in the presented image.
As Land's experiments showed, is it possible for normal humans to perceive (that is, to reliably and reproducibly report) a particular color when none of the wavelengths associated with that color are actual present in the presented image.
Yes, we don't disagree, but in an RGB system there's more than one way of looking at things. Subjectivity also features in colour blindness ("no that cup of tea is red father, not green")
L
L
Yes, but also keep in mind that the human three-band system isn't rigidly "RGB" in the sense of computer pixels. Human cone cells have broad, and overlapping, sensitivities (as shown in the Wikipedia-sourced diagram below); the so-called "red" and "green" in particular are quite similar in response.
I guess perception requires image processing... and it is that processing that opens you up to the world of illusion... language and culture come into play as the wavelengths associated with colour names will vary... I speak a language where green and blue have a single name... and so you need to qualify the colour by adding others... just as we do with brown (reddish brown, orange brown, yellow brown).
To say an object is a particular colour, assumes particular lighting conditions and perception of a colour also relates greatly to the perceiver. My eyes detect greens and reds differently to each other... I therefore perceive the same colour in two different ways... I personally would rather classify wavelength bands with names... then we can still perceive them however our mind chooses... but we can then say "you are perceiving the colour within the yellow wavelength range as green, you plonker". See same colour square A and B illusion
To say an object is a particular colour, assumes particular lighting conditions and perception of a colour also relates greatly to the perceiver. My eyes detect greens and reds differently to each other... I therefore perceive the same colour in two different ways... I personally would rather classify wavelength bands with names... then we can still perceive them however our mind chooses... but we can then say "you are perceiving the colour within the yellow wavelength range as green, you plonker". See same colour square A and B illusion
Good summary of color perception and cultural issues. See also Oliver Sacks' "The Case of the Colorblind Painter" for more details and some excellent references to the research.
You write, "I personally would rather classify wavelength bands with names," but since "wavelength bands" are not preceivable, that classification is intrinsically impossible in the context of human language development.
You write, "I personally would rather classify wavelength bands with names," but since "wavelength bands" are not preceivable, that classification is intrinsically impossible in the context of human language development.
Good point on language development... I guess as technology influences our perception (aided by augmented reality and the like) we may require to modify the way we classify things like colour. Perhaps even including artificial colour perception into future devices - ie the user wants to perceive this colour, better use the lighter one... thanks for the Oliver Sacks info.
What do you suggest as a more civilized mnemonic? Or is there a missing link?
I don't think there's a better mnemonic, other than maybe "roy g bv" (since "indigo" is a rather abstruse invention :-). Those colors are fairly universal in recognition.
Jan 1, 2011. 3:47 AMcraftyv
says:
Clothes maketh the man. I love the idea that you have been a lot more colourful in your dress than you realised. I wonder if this had an affect on how people interacted with you, you know, assuming you were a bright "colourful" person because that's what the colour of your clothes indicated. I bet an experiment has been done with this. Any ideas?
White surely is Roy G Biv... whereas black is the absence of light so really isn't a colour... or maybe it is and brown and black have been forced out of the colour wheel... is there some sort of colour apartheid going on???
Steady now, you didn't start with colour wheels. Are you talking about monochromatic light or something else?
L
Not nearly monochromatic... I guess I'm talking about a disappointingly wide range of wavelengths... just always thought of brown being a relatively tightly defined colour... had slightly too much time on my hands and wondered if anyone else had thought of brown in a similar way... :)
As the miller told his tale, so is a whiter shade of pale.
Why is it, that we don't see music videos of this quality anymore...???
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