Home Carbonation System...Cheap, Healthy, and Green.

The cost to convert water to soda water is less than $0.04 per 2-liter bottle,
and a single fill of a 20lb tank will charge over 500 bottles!

Here's a quick demo of how it works...

For those looking for the "Cilffs Notes" summary of how this works: Take a 20lb CO2 Tank and regulator, attach a tube, and stick a 99 cent locking ball air chuck (tire inflator) on the end of the tube. Pop a cheap snap-in tire valve (schrader valve) into a plastic soda bottle cap and you're ready to carbonate any liquid in about 30 seconds. Colder liquids absorb more CO2 carbonation.

If you're intrigued, explore the steps on subsequent pages for more details...

As far as a "soda substitute," you can easily add a splash of orange, cranberry, or other fruit juice, a twist of lemon or lime, alcoholic mixed drinks, commercial or homemade soda syrups,or whatever you like...Our family drinks a ton of sparkling water; as kids, we always preferred it to regular tap water, and it's much healthier than soda.

I've recently taken to flavoring my soda water with lemon juice; I freeze a bunch of ice cubes of freshly juiced lemons, then take out and zap a cube for 15 sec. in the microwave to throw in my drink...Really tasty, low calorie, and no added sugar...

I've also experimented, with amusing success, at carbonating cheap wines (read: Charles "Two Buck Chuck" Shaw from Trader Joe's) to make dirt cheap champagne...Just make sure the bottle is chilled first.

I had been toying with the idea of buying a home carbonator, but I was leery of the idea of being locked into a proprietary, closed system of buying expensive refill cartridges from a retail manufacturer like Sodastream...

I knew there had to be a better way. After all, this is just mixing CO2 and water.

In my research, I came across an incredibly detailed essay on carbonation by Richard Kinch, without which I could not have completed the project...I highly suggest reading over his opus before embarking on your own carbonation exploration.

http://www.truetex.com/carbonation.htm

All of this can be done for around $100, plus the deposit on a CO2 tank...

Given that the cost of a 2-liter bottle of sparkling water is now over $1 (California just doubled their CRV surcharges), and based on the volume of water that we drink, it's a no-brainer. Plus, there's the feeling of liberation of being able to drink as much sparkling water as you want (much like digital photography vs. wasting actual film).

I'm not an EnviroNut, but since we're all apparently supposed to pitch in and make a last-ditch effort to save the planet, these facts on the effects of plastic water bottles on the environment were of interest:

- Approximately 1.5 million barrels of oil - enough to run 100,000 cars for a whole year - are used to make plastic water bottles, while transporting these bottles to markets burns even more oil.

- According to a 2001 report of the World Wide Fund for Nature (WWF), roughly 1.5 million tons of plastic are expended in the bottling of 89 billion liters of water each year.

- The growth in bottled water production has increased water extraction in areas near bottling plants, leading to water shortages that affect nearby consumers and farmers. In addition to the millions of gallons of water used in the plastic-making process, two gallons of water are wasted in the purification process for every gallon that goes into the bottles.

- Nearly 90 percent of water bottles are not recycled and wind up in landfills where it takes thousands of years for the plastic to decompose.

Personally, it's really just nice not to have to lug a bunch of 2-liters home from the market anymore, carry them all in, and find places to store them. (I'm sure she'll find other chores for me to do soon enough...)

Enjoy!


- Ben


Alternatively...

If money is no object, and/or the carbonation system is under consideration for use by elderly / disabled (or simply lazy) individuals, there IS another option that doesn't involve shaking the bottles yourself...

- Purchase a Sodastream (from Bed, Bath, and Beyond with a 20% off coupon, or somewhere even beyond-er), procure a Co2 tank as described above, and purchase a Freedom One (or Freedom One+ system) from Co2Doctor.com to connect the Sodastream with the larger Co2 tank.  (choose the CGAWG or CGA option if you're on their order page.)  While the initial investment in the supplies is not quite as cheap (about an extra $200), and it's not quite as DIY, I recently set up both sets of my grandparents with this system, and they absolutely love it.

Step 1: Procuring your Precious Parts...

(see pictures below for the product labels, etc.)

- CO2 regulator, available from BeverageFactory.com, Kegworks.com, Amazon, or eBay (likely the cheapest way to go, but make sure you know what you're getting...)

- CO2 Tank; either ask to put a deposit on a 20lb CO2 tank for around $100 at a local beverage supply, bar supply, restaurant supply, soft drink, or beer distributor in your area, OR buy your own...Since you won't get your original tank back if you swap it out for a full tank, I'd recommend purchasing a reconditioned cylinder from Amazon.com or eBay.  Regardless of whether you end up buying or putting a deposit on a tank, you can swap out empty tanks for about $15-25. To find a supplier, first check here for the nearest Airgas supplier (a popular, nationwide chain).  They're the easiest way to go, possibly a tad higher prices than other places for a co2 tank swap.  Otherwise, call around, search google maps for beverage supply, welding supply, home brewery supply, or be creative; Barmade, the bar products company that I found in Los Angeles was very helpful...When I moved, I switched to swapping my empties out with Airgas.

- Locking Ball Chuck, either available at Harbor Freight or Monkey Grip part #M8871, available online or in stores at Kragen Auto Parts...in testing, users have said that the Kragen/PartsAmerica locking ball chuck wasn't as sturdy as the Harbor Freight chuck...and it's also an excuse to visit the tool mecca of Harbor Freight.  (Your mileage may vary.)

- Monkey Grip Rubberized Snap-In Tire Valve part #M4130, available online or in stores at Kragen Auto Parts...

Note:
After completing this instructable, I happened across an attachment for a screw-cap bottle that's not quite as DIY, but slightly more elegant (and slightly more expensive) than the tire valve solution...I haven't tested this option at all, but I'd assume it would work as an alternative...

Also, if you're concerned with the rubber snap-in valve leaching into the seltzer water, this may be a good option for you.  Based on my research, I have been replacing/swapping out the rubber snap-in valve caps much sooner than they would theoretically start to deteriorate, so it hasn't been a concern of mine over the past 5 years.  As a third option, they also make screw-on, stainless-steel-based tire valves, which would result in less rubber contacting the water.  I haven't tried these yet...if you end up using the stainless steel ones, drop me a line and let me know how it went !

$15 Screw-On carbonator cap from with ball-lock fitting MoreBeer.com

$5.49 Ball-Lock fitting for braided hose from MoreBeer.com

Stainless Steel Tire Valves

- 1/4" Threaded Full-Port Ball Valve (inline shut-off valve), available at Home Depot...The part number is 107-701HC; the SKU on the bar code appears to be 32888 07701...

- 10 foot roll of braided vinyl tubing, 1/4" internal diameter, available at Home Depot...The external diameter of this tubing is 1/2"...

- (3) hose barb adapters, 1/4" barb x 1/4" MIP, available at Home Depot...This part is a "Watts A-192" or "A-192/225." Do not get the "192B"...

- (4) 9/16" hose clamps, available at Home Depot...I found these in a package of 10, with a listed "range" of 1/4 to 5/8.

- (3) 3/4" plastic pipe clamps, available at Home Depot...

- roll of 1/2" teflon tape...

- a 2 liter bottle and cap.

Comments

[waltbosz]

I really recommend for anyone that wants to do this Instructable to spend the extra money to get the Carbonator Cap that is mentioned. I started with the tire stem and I found it to have a number of problems. 1. The chuck did not secure onto the valve stem very well which resulted in a lot of wasted CO2. 2. The stem left a bad rubber taste to the water. 3. The carbonator cap and ball lock really do lock together well for a good secure fit which is important while shaking the bottle to mix up the water & CO2.

Other than that, this is a great Instructable. I love being able to make seltzer at home. I was able to get a 20lb CO2 tank, regulator, hoses, and 2 beer taps for $150 off CraigsList.

[pcooper2]

The Carbonater cap from Liquid Bread, Inc. has apparently been redesigned so that the ball-lock connector can no longer be locked in place.  All one can do is press the connector onto the Carbonater cap for a short burst of CO2, whereupon one is to shake the bottle and repeat the process 5-7 times.

[waltbosz]

Also, I've been thinking of upgrading my setup to use an industrial carbonator like the ones used in restaurant soda fountains. This Instructable shows you how to set one up http://www.instructables.com/id/How-to-Install-a-soda-fountain/ , or you can visit that author's original web page http://www.boneville.net/soda/start.htm

[frkdante]

Anyone know if there is a thing as CO2 pills? Sort of like seltzer tablets? If so, one would be able to drop a few in a water bottle.

[pcooper2]

Chunks of dry ice will work, but it's relatively expensive, and if you drop it into a PET soda bottle and tighten the cap, you have little control over the peak pressure. The results would be bad for your health and others around you if the bottle should burst. Moreover, dry ice is very cold and will result in severe frostbite injury unless handled with tongs. It's much safer to work with a regulated gas supply from a cylinder.

[lukeyj15]

Dry ice?

[urbanpirate]

you could use a tiny bit of yeast in a sealed bottle but be very careful, unattended for long enough and it WILL explode

[snowluck2345]

are standard welding gas cylinders food safe and do they contain food safe co2?

[pcooper2]

Carbon dioxide gas is carbon dioxide gas. It all comes from the same place, whether it's used for welding, paintball guns or pressurizing a soda system

[razldazl15]

I just cam across "BOB’S ENDLESS SELTZER SYSTEM" http://www.gravikord.com/seltzer.html ; from the picture it looks like a soda syphon connected to a CO2 tank. Has anyone tried some similar setup? This would negate the whole plastic bottle use and maybe even some of the shacking.

[pcooper2]

The Bob's Endless Seltzer System page is a bit skimpy on details. It appears to use a large external stainless steel keg as a water reservoir, pressurized with a regulated CO2 source, to force carbonated water through a cold plate mounted in the refrigerator via some tubing that passes through a hole one must drill into the refrigerator wall. That means the keg needs to be periodically refilled with filtered water and one would need to wait 24-48 hours for gas to diffuse into the water before it's ready to use. Something the size and weight of a stainless steel beer keg filled with water is almost certainly too heavy to pick up and shake to accelerate gas absorption. It's not clear if the siphon bottle needs to be continuously left connected to the hose in the refrigerator, or if one can disconnect it to carry it to the table and elsewhere. The current price for the siphon bottle is about $166, and they say one can assemble the complete system for about $400, depending on where one gets the parts. This Instructables project comes in quite a bit cheaper.

[whayden]

I've copied this set up and it works pretty well. My questions is why we need to shake the water bottle, whereas the Penguin or Soda Stream just squirts the gas in?

The shaking is a pain in the butt. How do we get our system to work (shake free) like theirs?

[pcooper2]

Shaking the bottle vastly increases the area of contact between the gas and the liquid, accelerating the absorption of CO2 into the water.

If you have a secure, leak-free connection to the CO2 supply, all you need to do is pressurize the empty space above the liquid to 60 psi, or so, and the patience to wait 24-48 hours.  The gas will diffuse into the liquid without shaking until a saturated solution is produced.  It's the exact reverse of uncapping a soda and leaving it on your counter at ambient pressure, allowing the CO2 to come out of solution and dissipate in the air.

[Spokehedz]

Their system wastes gas by injecting it into the water, which mixes the gas and water so that the gas can mix into the water. But, since such a small amount of gas has any chance to mix with the water (it's in the water for milliseconds, then it bubbles out the top) you have to press the button over and over again until enough gas has been mixed into the liquid... which wastes gas.

This system does not waste any gas, because it is a closed system. You shake the bottle to get the gas to mix with the water. That's why you have to shake it. If you don't like shaking it, then by all means buy the more expensive products that do all the hard work for you. I won't, but you can do whatever you want.

I suppose in THEORY that if you had a long tube put from the bottom of the inlet valve that had a very small air bubbler from a aquarium store you COULD get away from not shaking so much, but you would have to inject the gas, open the lid, and inject more gas until you had the right pressure--but you would still be wasting gas and the major point of this entire Instructable is that by doing a little bit of work you can save huge amounts of money

It is also slightly more dangerous (although, not much more dangerous than brewing beer at home which many people do) because there is no valve to release the pressure from the bottle except for the cap. However, this is a minimal risk, as soda bottles have to be tested to some crazy high number like 150PSI without exploding because people leave bottles in the backs of cars all the time.

[whayden]

(removed by author or community request)

[asteadman]

Great Instructable!

I built this exactly as written. Had a couple issues with product numbers, but got enough info to get the right parts.

Had friends over and got to impress their kids buy making "Coke" from scratch. Too much fun!

One question... Once in the glass, the cola loses fizz VERY fast. 5 minutes maybe? Any idea what I'm doing wrong? I do live in Montana. Could elevation be an issue?

Thanks again for posting. Fun weekend project while waiting for my cider to harden. :)

[asteadman]

Forgot to mention that I DID use the pre-fab cap from your link. Seems to work well, but it does leak under pressure. Anybody else experience this?

[bearing1]

Well Done
Great to see someone making their own seltzer and not using the store bought and chintzy method. I have been doing it for years. Only I have been refilling the old antique bottles from the 20's and 30's. Almost the same method but use a 35 PSI pump to fill the bottles with water, invert them bleed out the air usually it takes to times to fill the bottle. I use chilled water when filling then pressure with the C02. I normally shake while injecting the CO2 for more fizz. This puts to use my old and wonderful bottles. Now they are not just to look at but use on a regular basis. The water will stay "charged" indefinetly as it is sealed and the C02 is the propellant and shoots the water out when pressing the lever. 

[breitung1]

Nice instructable. I've basically done the same thing using a lot of your method. The RUBBER based stem, however, degrades in the CO2 atmosphere making the water taste like rubber.

I solved this by moving to METAL based stems - I found bent ones used for motorcycles to help the bottles fit in my fridge. Instead of 2L, I use 3L because the caps are larger and allow the fitting of the metal stem into the cap.

Rather than using a rubber gasket, i was careful to not tear the thin polymer film that's on the underside of every soda bottle. Usually available for about $1/bottle if you buy one with store brand orange soda. Using stainless steel washers and a nut to press the thin film against the underside of the plastic of the cap, i easily got a good seal.

I've been using the same bottles for at least 3 years - it's probably time to switch, but it's a great system.

Also - the metal fittings will allow for the insertion of a tube that can go to near the bottom of the bottle so you don't have to shake!

[ameno6]

So, how do the bubbles compare with store-bought fizzy water?

[letsapocalypso]

MUCH more bubbly...(Like at least 1.5 - 2x as carbonated)...Which also means that it lasts longer in the bottle before it goes flat!

[timbooth]

Regarding the questions below on shaking by us compared with injecting by Soda stream.
I hold my bottles upsidedown whilst bubbling the gas in, thereby causing the gas to pass through the water, this reduces, but does not eliminate the shaking requirement.

[Eddie_T]

Since we have to shake vigorously to carbonate I wonder how Sodastream accomplishes it without shaking?

[llathrop]

http://stores.kegconnection.com/Detail.bok?no=245
everything but the co2 tank, in an assembled kit, including carbonator cap for less than the cost of parts everywhere else...and they shipped quick! they also have a kit with the tank.I happened to check these guys for the regulator as they were local to me, but it turns out they moved a few cities away. still the best price I found .

[mugsisme]

Well, started gathering the supplies, bought a chuck at Pep Boys, opened it up and see that it says to wash your hands after touching it as according to the state of CA, it contains materials known to cause cancer, etc. Are they all like that?

[stevenh429]

What exactly is a "plastic pipe clamp"?

I am going to make this soon

[stevenh429]

oh sorry, i was on a computer with out those picture notes :O, now i get it

[joe.seltzer]

I love the idea of this and I actually am in the process of setting it up, but I would love to use bottles other than plastic 2 litter bottles. Those are the worst kind of plastic and using them over and over again doesn't sound very good and buying fresh ones all the time seems to defeat the purpose. Has anyone found glass or aluminum bottles that work with this system?

J

[screamkitty]

You can get a generic dual-gauge CO2 regulator for $42 at SodaDispenserDepot.com.

You could also buy a used carbonator for $150

..And, you can add the final touch with a used soda gun for ~ $75 - $85

[beehard44]

do you think this'll work with a co2 air duster?
because i still need to travel just to get a small, expensive can of co2 but i can easily buy an air duster for $4

[bwpatton1]

Most ''canned air products'' contain refrigerant R134a (Tetrafluoroethane, same stuff used in car air conditioning). Which is inherently bad for ingestion! Try a Paintball Co2 cylinder with some type of regulator apparatus.

[surfzombie]

NO Do not use an air duster. most of them have an additive put in them to keep durggoes fromo huffing the stuff but, You could use a paintball tank setup such as this one or cobble together your own. See link

http://stores.kegconnection.com/Categories.bok?category=*Soda%2C+Soft+Drink%3ASoda+Kits%2C+Carbonating

[beehard44]

i made some calculations and a 250mL can of co2 can yield 150 bottles approx, when compared to the 500 bottle capacity of a 20lb co2 cylinder (and that the stuff in the cylinder is liquid)
any ideas? anyone?

[snowluck2345]

that sounds wrong, i realy don't feel like doing calculations, schools out and i'm done with ap chem, no more. but based on the volume of a 20lb cylinder and assuming they both contain liquids, a co2 tank is much bigger than 4 times the volume. also, the critical point of co2 is at around 80 farenhite, welding tanks regularly go over that, so they switch between being super critical fluids and normal liquids, based on the tempature, and turn into gases once they get low on pressure. Welding tanks are up to 3000psi.

[gromit1943]

Can an ordinary pop bottle safely withstand 50 psig?

I wonder what pressure a bottle of Coke, say, is at when opened.

--Terry

[Eurober]

!00% of the bottles can stand well over 100psi, the reason for this is that Coca-Cola does not wish bad press and the expenses associated if a Coke bottle left it in the sun in the car while shopping would explode. The dissolved gas in a warm liquid is rather small (Henry's law), therefore the pressure increases to over 100PSI and the bottle has to hold. I read somewhere that 90% of the bottles can stand 150PSI.

[rloomis]

Is there risk to having the water in plastic containers in terms of pollutants?
http://www.livestrong.com/article/131237-dangers-plastic-containers/


Just curious. I really like the idea of carbonation my water.

[gromit1943]

Thank you for your reply. I stand reassured.

--Terry

[clibanarius]

Yes, we had our first glass of home-made seltzer tonight! I'd already had a 20oz paintball CO2 canister and a Gentec regulator (which I think is usually used for welding), so there were a number of different issues to solve. But so far so good! Still need to learn how to control the flow better with this setup.

[nitehawk86]

Also a 20lb tank is massivly overkill. I use 5lb tanks that are easy to get at any beer distributor. I serve with the gas as well as carbonate, so I am not sure how much carbonation I could get out of a single tank, however it is quite a bit.

[surfzombie]

This is a good instructable but I just wanted to add that your really don't need any more co2 pressure than 40psi I run mine at 25 and it has plenty of fizz. Make sure that your water or whatever you carbonating is really cold when you start. Any more than 40psi and your just wasting precious co2 gas. Try it at 25 and see what you think. If you want more fizz then go up from there. But again I love this article and all the detail you have put into it. Thanks for sharing it.

[jamesh]

Rather than use the rubber tire valve, which I have found to add an unpleasant taste to my seltzer and beer, you can find all-metal semi-truck valve stems at most tire repair shops.

James H

[jamesh]

Here are pictures:

[snowluck2345]

i always worry about the food safety of things like this, what do you think?

[Lance Mt.]

Awesome.

[hossmonkey]

Can either of these regulators from Harbor freight be used for the project? If not could you explain why?


http://www.harborfreight.com/regulator-gauge-94841.html
or
http://www.harborfreight.com/oxygen-regulator-94846.html


Thanks!

[misfist]

You'd need an adapter to connect to your CO2 tank:
CGA-580 Regulator to CGA-320 Cylinder (CO2 tank)

[hossmonkey]

So yes, but I would need something like this to get it to work?



http://www.shoplet.com/Western-enterprises-Brass-Cylinder-Adaptors-810/SEPTLS312810/spdv

[misfist]

The one shown in the link doesn't say what kind of adapter it is. But, what you'll need will look similar to that. You need either a CGA-580 to CGA-320 adapter or a CGA-540 to CGA-320 adapter (depending which regulator you get)

For http://www.harborfreight.com/oxygen-regulator-94846.html
You need an adapter for:
From Cylinder: CGA-320 Carbon Dioxide
To Regulator : CGA-540 Oxygen
Like this one: http://www.restockit.com/western-enterprises-brass-cylinder-adaptor-cga-320-540-(312-806).html

For http://www.harborfreight.com/regulator-gauge-94841.html
You need an adapter for:
From Cylinder: CGA-320 Carbon Dioxide
To Regulator: CGA-580 Argon, Helium or Nitrogen
Like this one: http://www.arizonatools.com/welding-cylinder-tools-and-adapters/detail/WESWD-810 

CGA = Compressed Gas Association

[hossmonkey]

Thanks for the info!!!

[vermillion42x]

For anyone trying to make homemade soda with brand name syrups, I've done a little math to help figure things out. I'm still on the fence myself, but I figured I would share my information, since the thought of fountain coke at home made me giddy. My calculations are based on the cost of 5 gallon bags of syrup ($70.80) and not the carbonation cost:

If you buy 2-liter bottles it would cost $1.16 per bottle in syrup (reg $.99)
If you buy 20 oz bottles it would cost $0.34 per bottle in syrup (reg $.74 in packs)
If you buy 12oz cans it would cost $0.20 per can in syrup (reg $.50 in 24 pack)

SO, for those of us who buy 2-liter bottles on a regular basis, it's a waste of money. BUT for those of us who buy 20oz bottles or cans, it makes some financial sense to switch to home-carbonated. Personally, I just don't drink enough to justify the savings, nor should I drink that much soda. Barring sugary consequences, I would totally do it though.

For those serious about it, I found syrups by googling "coca cola syrup supplier" to find real sales links, or you can find a restaurant supply near you.

[hossmonkey]

Not sure where you live or where you buy Coke, but in Oregon I'd say the average cost for a 2L is around $2.00 and the lowest sale price I've seen is 0.88 at Safeway. Not to mention I may have to buy more than one to get the sale price.

Even if your numbers are correct, I don't see where you've accounted for the cost of:

1) Fuel and time cost to get the pop/soda.

2) The ability to re-carbonate flat pop/soda. (no waste)

3) Recycle cost whether or not you have a bottle bill? (No taking bottles back to the store well for us that live in the smart states that have a bottle bills)

4) Environmental cost impact reduction.

There may be more but I think peeps get the idea!

Not to mention how cool would it be to make your own pop with SUGAR and not HFCS!

Thanks for the break down!

[jamesh]

Here is a great resource if you would like to learn more about the theory, temperature dependence, and economics of this method:

http://www.truetex.com/carbonation.htm

[misfist]

Great instructions, thanks!!

Just put together my system today (no pictures yet). The set-up is the same as the instructions, except that I'm using a ball-lock fitting and Carbonator Cap. Everything seems to be working as it should be and I've carbonated several different beverages already. I do have a couple questions that I'm hoping someone can answer:

1) When it's not in use, should the CO2 canister valve be kept shut off? I have a shut-off directly on the regulator and another in-line (for easier access), but I'm not sure if these are sufficient when not in use. Any idea?

2) I find the Carbonator Cap quite difficult to get on the ball-lock fitting and am wondering if anyone has had this experience. Any input would be much appreciated.

Again, thanks for the great instructions and all the helpful comments!

[woody558]

can I use a bike pump for this?

[Esmagamus]

No. Air is not CO2, so, you can't carbonate water with air. Water dissolves CO2, not air.

[Pazzerz]

Correction: Air does dissolve into water. It is why fish can breathe. It is also why aeration at your local sewage plant works to help the microscopic critters in the sewage to breathe and eat the solids in the water, thereby helping them to clean up the water.

On another note: Cold water absorbs the CO2 faster, but it also releases it faster, thus the need to keep the bottles capped.

I worked in wastewater treatment for a number of years...

[MathiasAlvin]

What about one of those CO2 bike inflators? I think this idea would work great with one of those. You could just keep it in your kitchen drawer.

[ccopyrites1986]

there is a drink mixer (what the three stooges used to use to spray water at each other) that is essentially just water in a container being pressurized by a CO2 cartridge from a bike pump or whatever.

that its actual use is to make seltzer water.

[misfist]

Are you talking about a soda syphon?

Like this one: http://www.amazon.com/iSi-2248-ISI-Soda-Siphons/dp/B0033YU0G4

If so, it's made to make seltzer (soda water) and uses a small CO2 cartridge.

[killbox]

ive done this, if so be sure to use the canisters for dusting, they are less likely to have oil in them. also that technique lacks the pressure regulator hes using, while sodabottles can static test up to 200psi, i had one catastrophically blow out a 3 liter bottle.

It blew out one of the "feet of the bottle" rocketed it into my ceiling, smashed my lightfixture and then broke a window. All the while hosing down my kitchen.

[Arx]

dusting canisters could also be hydrofluorocarbons instead of CO2.

The biggest problem with those little containers is that they're tiny. you'll be using a $0.50 cartridge to make a bottle of water. Even the store-bought Soda makers are too expensive.

Get a 20lb tank, and It'll last a long time. I've had mine for around a year, and haven't had to fill it yet.
A friend of mine got a 10lb a little while later, and is just running out of gas now.

A refill is about $20. Less than the cost of one of the little refills for one of the storebought ones that only does a couple dozen bottles.

[MathiasAlvin]

AwWW! That just sealed the deal for me! I like a little danger in my seltzer!

[frollard]

You could, but while CO2 is CO2, bike inflator whippets aren't guaranteed food safe, and might have contaminants in there.

[dchall8]

Point of order. I agree you cannot carbonate water with air because air is mostly nitrogen. At best you'd be 'nitrogenating' the water. Aerate is probably a better term. All gasses can dissolve in water. The colder the better. CO2 charging with yeast was probably the first carbonation method. Now we overcharge water with CO2 - much faster than waiting for yeast to go to work. You still cannot use a bike pump unless you live in a CO2 universe and don't mind the volatile oils used to lubricate the pump in your drink.

[roystonlodge]

Wondering if anybody's ever tried using a CO2 tank from a paintball gun.

[misfist]

Yes, this can be done; however, you will likely need some kind of an adapter.

Most paintball canisters have a pin-valve, with which a regulator won't work. The simplest solution is to get a specially-made paintball to CGA 320 (or paintball to regulator) adapter.

Here are a couple links:

Aquatek AQUATEK CO2 Paintball Tank CGA 320 Adapter: http://aquatek-california.web.officelive.com/AQUATEKAccessories.aspx (available for sale on eBay, Amazon and other stores)

Unknown brand: http://cgi.ebay.com/Adapter-PAINTBALL-tank-conversion-CO2-Regulator-/350362950038?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item5193425996

Good luck!

[alienrobot]

I put this together and it works fine BUT, I REALLY REALLY recommend that you do not use the scrader valve setup. It stinks, yes it stinks, it smells really bad. The valve it self stinks before installing it, no matter how much you wash it. And it makes your water stink. As soon as you open the bottle after carbonating the air that comes out really stinks. If you are doing this project please spend a little extra money for "The Carbonator" and a ball lock fitting http://bit.ly/h4TfV9 which are designed for food purposes. I bought 2 Carbonator caps. I keep 3 bottles in the fridge and rotate them. The third bottle does not have the cap and is not carbonating but it is in the fridge getting cold . . . cold water really is the most important ingredient in getting a really nice bottle of fizzy water.

[Arx]

I totally agree. That rubber leaches like crazy.

Keep in mind, it doesn't necessarily even need a ball lock or anything.

I simply took a stainless steel bolt, drilled a tiny hole down the centre of it, and machined the threads off near the end. (turned it into a barb with threads at the base)

I then drilled a hole in a bottle cap, put the bolt through, and threaded a nut onto the remaining threads.

I have a ball valve shuttoff after the regulator anyways, so I just screw my cap onto the bottle of ice cold water (colder makes it absorb CO2 easier), turn on the gas, and shake the bottle until I hear the gas stop hissing in (and the regulator needle stops bobbing).

Shut off the gas and let it sit for 20-30 seconds (or a couple minutes if I'm making something with sugar, or beer)

Open and enjoy. No butyl rubber, or potentially lead-leaching brass involved.

[Eurober]

Excellent job considering I just completed mine a week ago and it looks very similar to yours! The only differences are:
1. I housed everything in a "carbonation station", which was constructed making use of a "sonotube" piece, 16" diameter, 32" height and painted with a "kitchen" color.
2. The tank is a 15lb bought at Carbonation Services in San Jose for around $80.
3. The pressure regulator was originally an oxygen one, modified with a CGE320 nipple.
With "our method" one can carbonate any beverage without the problem to have the content gushing out as in the Sodastream method.
Gene

[Shiggity]

After some research and discussion here, I'm pretty confident that the parts listed in this Instructable contain lead.  On January 1, 2010, the state of California has required brass fittings to be lead-free, but until then, there are a lot of parts that have lead mixed into the alloy.

For instance, the "hose barb adapter" 1/4" barb X 1/4" MIP, A-192/225, which has product number 17000192, is not on Watts' list of lead-free products, which can be found at www.watts.com/pro/divisions/LeadFree/WattsLeadFree.xls.

Before using the method described herein to force pressurized gas into potable solution, it seems that people should first ascertain that they are not unwittingly consuming lead by-products.

[carpespasm]

Since it's staying gaseous the whole time I don't think that there's any reason that there'd be lead winding up in the drink. There's not any point where the drink winds up in contact with a lead-bearing element would there be? Even if there were minimal contact with lead, if you're not pregnant or under 5 the amount you'd get is so minimal it'll never harm you.

[shuboyje]

The section on Brass in the link I'm posting will teach you how to remove the surface lead with simple home chemicals based on a process designed by NASA.

http://www.realbeer.com/jjpalmer/Welding.txt

[Shiggity]

A little more research convinces me that it's easiest to find substitutes for all these parts at a local home brew store (or online, if there's a good source).  They should have equivalents that don't use lead alloys.

[sjoobbani]

Trader joes?!
not by any chance an oregonian..?

[lukeyj15]

I'm just a tad concerned about the CO2 cylinder valve supporting the weight of the cylinder. I can see that it doesn't quite fit, but aren't you worried about snapping the valve and ending up with a missile?

[Lee Gee]

Has anyone pressure-tested any of the any of the different types of bottles? Or does anyone know if there is a spec for the max pressure capability? I am real concerned about a bottle exploding. Especially a glass one. Could be a killer. This concerns me because I want to charge the liquid at maybe closer to 100 PSIG so I will probably be closer to the limit for soft drink containers. I could charge the container remotely but then there is the increased pressure as the liquid warms up and that could cause a rupture of the bottle when it is out in public. Not good!

[urbanpirate]

if you are really worried about pressure and bottle integrity look for Belgian beers and champaign bottles. they are the strongest glass bottles available. (and chimay is damn tasty)

[letsapocalypso]

I think soda bottles are rated up to about 100psi, but the snap-in tire valves may fail first if you're going that high...They should start leaking, instead of exploding or anything catastrophic...Let us know how it went! (hopefully with both eyes and major appendages still intact...)

[dchall8]

A bottle explosion when the bottle is full of liquid is relatively harmless - messy but harmless. Now a bottle explosion when the bottle was empty to start with is quite another matter. I don't want to be near when that happens. Compressed gas is much more hazardous than compressed liquid. That's why the compressed gas containers are made of steel or very thick aluminum. One of my neighbors ran over a football with his car the other day. You could hear that explosion for several blocks. Had he run over a bottle of water, you'd only hear the splash. The reason you regulate the gas pressure to 45 psi is to keep the bottle from exploding. All soda bottles are pressurized.

[turnerfromdh]

ive heard soda bottles go up to 90psi

[Fridg]

The bottles will start to expand and warp around 100 pi and explode at 145 but that's if its all air, just like dchall8 said if its filled with water its pretty much harmless

[wlai]

I finally got around to doing this instructables, and i was very helpful. I did have to adjust a bit, as the barbed connector at my regular was larger and I had to use a different gauge of hosing, but it worked out after a trip to the hardware store. One question, on the PSI of a charged tank: my regular shows at maximum opening / minimum regulation that I'm only getting 40 psi, and I found the carbonation insufficient. Can I ask the CO2 supplier to charge it at a higher psi? If so, is there a reason not to ask for upto 100 psi, and let the regulator to step it down to 50psi?

[frollard]

The pressure in the tank will be something ridiculous like 1000 psi. The external regulator is to set what comes out of the hose, which should be around 50psi. 100 would work, but is drastically unsafe.

[frollard]

I got a sodastream about a year ago and they have a real nifty feature that would be easy to add, to save some arm work

The CO2 is injected identically to this process, but thru a dip tube such that its forced to bubble through the water rather than just hit the top surface. You don't have to shake and in about 10 seconds after you've injected, it's totally carbonated...

One word of warning is that regular pop bottles have a very limited lifespan - PARTICULARLY after they have been crinkled (stressed and turned milky white at the seam). That stress can release some nasty not-so-food-good chemicals into your drink. Only ever use mild detergent on the bottle, and never high temperatures. Only use a few times before recycling properly and replacing.

[magicruss]

why not add a injector that press fit into the under side of the cap vale (possibly a crimped piece of brass or copper tubing )that projects into the liquid .that way you you carbonate two directions at once

[keng]

don't use brass or copper cuz prolonged contact with seltzer will force chemicals to leach out. use stainles instead.

[dchall8]

Can you explain that a little more, please. Copper is standard in the distillation industry because copper is antiseptic - it kills germs on contact. What chemicals are leached from CO2 and copper interaction?

[JoeMenthol]

VERY IMPORTANT!!!
NEVER use copper or brass fittings when carbonating beverages or dealing with carbonic acid (a product of carbonation).  Carbonic acid reacts with copper and copper alloys to produce poisonous byproducts.  ONLY use stainless steel fittings when setting up a system like this for any kind of carbonation, and never store carbonated beverages in copper or brass containers.

[cygnosis]

Just to be clear, the copper and/or brass in this system is only in contact with the CO2, not the carbonated water. CO2 regulators for use in beverage carbonation are commonly made of brass and pose no real health risk.  The Beverage Factory sells one, in fact. 

In this system the internals of the bicycle tire valve are the only piece that may come in contact with carbonic acid.  Whether they are food safe or not, I can't say.  But in general you shouldn't be scared to use brass for your CO2 line.

[thecheatscalc]

Just out of curiosity, is the CO2 in that canister food grade? Also, I should think a small chunk of dry ice would work, although... you could have a bottle bomb if you're not careful. I guess a pressure regulator would be in the works.

[kill-a-watt]

My refiller (a fire extinguisher service center, btw), says he fills tanks for kegs, soda bars, paint-ball, salt water fishtanks, and welders like me. He does mix gases, but only beer gas (mix of nitrogen and co2), not the argon/co2 stuff I sometimes weld with.

All the co2 comes from the same source, and he never adds oil to the tanks either.

Talk to your supplier if you want to know.

[zombiehunter96]

I have read that its all the same and that restraunts buy their Co2 tanks from the same place as everyone else.

[magickaldan]

From what I've read all CO2 is food grade they just label it for legal sake.

[ericrw1]

Great concept...just built my system yesterday in 10 minutes. I used a carbonator cap and ball lock valve...much cleaner setup, no brass, etc. This also eliminates the need for a shut off valve. I pull the hose with the ball lock valve out from under the sink, place it onto the 2 liter over the sink, carbonate, and return. I transfer the water to glass bottles for fridge storage, so nothing is leached from the plastic bottle.

[alahav]

what about a glass bottle with a swing top?
Amazon has a cheap liter bottle for 5 bucks.

http://www.amazon.com/Swing-Italian-Bottle-Approx-Capacity/dp/B002KGOSPK

[elcontestador]

Nice! I have to try making some soda when I have some free time.  Someone else posted a guide, but it's not as good as yours here squidoo.com/customsoda

[chillywillycd]

just want to say thanks, that i just set up my system, and it worked great!

special tweak of mine was that i was actually modifying a kegerator/draft system, and installed a quick disconnect off the regulator so that i can swap between force carbonating beverages, and dispensing draft beer.

thanks again!

[wascostreet]

I just built my own home carbonator using this instructable, and it works great! No pics right now, sorry. I used a regulator for an oxygen tank (from an oxyacetylene welding kit) and a 200-psi-rated air compressor hose with 1/4" NPT threaded ends. I bolted it directly to the regulator on one end and to the ball valve shutoff on the other. This has fewer possible leak sources than the nipple/clamp/hose setup, I think. On the other side of the shutoff, I used a quick-couple for compressed air tools to attach the air chuck, since it allows the chuck to swivel for ease of use. I'm getting some minor leakage from the air chuck itself if I bend the tire valve when it's inserted and pressurized, but none if I hold it straight. Total cost about $140 including the CO2 tank and fill. I have one concern, though. Since so much of the hardware for this kit uses brass, is there a significant risk of lead contamination? The valve stem that I'm using in the bottle cap has some brass that is in contact with the water, so it's possible that it could leach, I guess. I'm wondering if any professionals can offer an opinion.

[magickaldan]

If there was any lead in brass they wouldn't let it be used in domestic water systems. Brass is mainly composed of zinc and copper.

[dchall8]

Brass has no lead in it so lead would not be a problem. You might be thinking of other apparatus(es) that are soldered together with tin-lead solder. You can use silver solder from any hardware store (used for all copper pipe in households).

[Shiggity]

Yeah, brass "has no lead in it" except that... BRASS HAS LEAD IN IT.  Check out where Wikipedia says "To enhance the machinability of brass, lead is often added in concentrations of around 2%. This lead is present on the surface of the material, and thus presents a health concern similar to that of pure lead."  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brass#Lead_Content

So, does anyone who KNOWS whether this is actually dangerous wanna put in their two cents since we might be poisoning ourselves with this method?

[evad]

There are many alloys (types) of brass... Basic brass is zinc and copper, period. The brass used in plumbing fixtures is generally C23000 red brass. red brass is 85% copper, 15% Zinc. Look it up, like I did, (Metals Selector, 1993) in a legitimate source. Sometimes, bronze is used, which is copper and tin instead of copper and zinc. Again, the alloy -brass or bronze- used in plumbing fixtures has NO LEAD.

The brass that Wiki is talking about is called leaded brass or free machining brass. Lead is added to the brass to make it machinable. The lead is contained IN the brass, and yes, there will be some lead on the surface.

Plumbing fittings are cast, of red brass or the appropriate bronze, and NOT of the machinable brasses.. Yes, there is post cast machining that takes place to cut threads and seats in valves and elbows and such, but there in NO lead used in that process.

There is now NO LEAD in plumbing solder... This was mandated federally in the 80's as I recall. If you have 50/50 tin/lead solder at home- dispose of it properly, and go buy tin/silver PLUMBING solder. You can get it anywhere: From a plumbing supply house to WalMart.

An added note: If your house is older than, say 40 years, all your copper plumbing was soldered with lead/tin solder. My house, and the house I grew up in has lead/tin solder. How come I don't have lead poisoning?

[Shiggity]

If you are confident that all the materials you're using contain neither no lead nor any other compound that might slowly poison you, great! I eventually just bit the bullet and bought a commercial water carbonator.

By the way, how do you know you DON'T have lead poisoning? :) Many of us were exposed to things we didn't know were harmful at the time, best if we avoid them as much as is reasonably possible, since I'm not sure "I drank a bunch of leaded water/breathed a bunch of second-hand smoke/lived under a bunch of asbestos/covered myself with a bunch of DDT, and I'M okay" is really an argument that is very persuasive, at least to me.

[dchall8]

If you're that skeptical you'll have to have your brass fittings tested by yourself.  If you read on in your Wikipedia link you'll see that brass used for plumbing fixtures has no lead in it.  That's usually good enough for US consumers. 

[Shiggity]

 Do you refer to the excerpt "By July 1, 2020 in California, lead-free brass (brass containing less than 0.25% lead) must be used for 'each component that comes into contact with the wetted surface of pipes and pipe fittings, plumbing fittings and fixtures'?"  Because that refers to only one state in the US, and the realization of this is set eleven years in the future, which implies that plumbing fittings AREN'T currently lead-free.

I don't know how to have my brass fittings tested for lead, or if a CO2 purifier would be necessary, but I really think people doing this should know that they could very well be drinking poison on a daily basis until there is evidence to the contrary.

[marsneedsrabbits]

A home lead test, which is available at most hardware stores, might be an option. The ones I have seen were maybe 7-12 dollars, and had 2-4 tests.
The one I have used had a swab that required that you bend it to release liquid, then required that you rub the swab on the surface of the item to be tested. If the swap turned a specific color (pink, I think) then lead was present.

[dchall8]

Good points and the piece in question is a tire valve...not exactly a food grade piece of equipment. 

[Shiggity]

Noticed that California's laws actually seem to have Jan 1, 2010 as the lead-free date - so I changed the Wikipedia article to agree with the work cited.  Companies like Watts who make some of the items listed in this Instructable are indeed moving toward lead-free parts... but it is probably worth verifying online that the parts are indeed lead-free since there are bound to be some left over that aren't.

[Shiggity]

Agreed

[wcanyon]

The thing that I'd really like to see with this is a better reusable bottle. The 2 liter bottles that you get at the store seem like they'd wear down over time, plus I hear bad things about chemicals leaching out (which I'm not sure I believe). The sodaclub bottles look a lot more sturdy and easier to clean out. If anyone has found some clear reusable PET bottles please share.

[Esmagamus]

When my brother worked at a bank, he used to to work a shaker with protein powder and a bottle of water to make a protein shaker for lunch. The flavouring on the protein powder was so strong the water in the bottle always tasted like strawberries! PET is far from being a strong barrier.

[pbasch]

I agree that the bottle is the least attractive part of this system. I just got a carbonation system (5# CO2 tank, regulator, hose, and a Carbonator) for about $215 at a home brewery supply store. Totally cool. And I am using a 2liter plastic bottle, and then decanting into a glass bottle. What I really want to do is use my old seltzer syphon! I miss the schpritzing. So I will get a 2nd Carbonator (additional $20), an 2nd CO2 cartridge holder for my syphon ($10), and cut the threaded part off the cartridge holder, and epoxy it into the middle of the carbonator. If anyone has a better idea, I'd love to hear it.

[TallTrav]

Check out bulk CO2 for air guns. They're called "Dummy" CO2 cartridges. They have a threaded hole in the main body for connection to a bulk tank (like paint ball). They look the same as your standard CO2 charger for your siphon. Around $25 I think...not exactly free. You could always drill and tap a spent cartridge. Not sure how long they'd last though.

[wcanyon]

I found a link here that states that some plastic bottles release BPA and it is not good for you (according to JAMA): http://www.blogher.com/plastic-bottle-safety-update-jama-says-bpa-poses-serious-health-risks

Still working on finding a nice looking reusable 1 or 2 liter bottle. HDPE? Or maybe glass is the way to go...

[megmaine]

I'd like to find a stainless steel bottle for this. Not only cost, but also the thought of drinking things that have been stored any length of time in a plastic bottle, is my motivator. I know one can get a stainless seltzer bottle with one of the proprietary systems, but that's if you're willing to pay endlessly to "subscribe" to their system. I wish I didn't like fizzy drinks, but with everything else I can't have diet-wise, something somewhere's got to give. Gotta have something to call a treat or else go mad, and it's too late for me to try to be an ascetic.

[wcanyon]

Replying to myself again... edit button? Nope.

Anyway, found a lot of bottles here: http://www.ebottles.com/showbottles.asp?familyid=2

[Mtalus]

For people who like to,...umm..twist things, you can get valves that have a threaded shank and a compression nut seal. It's what I used just because I had one around. The auto parts store is loaded with options. I don't worry about using a metal stemmed valve as I use this top only to carbonate and then switch out. At any rate the rubber stems have a metal core as well. Works for carbonating homebrew too, and in such an elegant bottle. Sure to impress.

[baumgrenze]

Has anyone tried using a 5 gallon soda fountain can to make a batch all at once? They are available from home brewing stores, along with a hose that makes a quick disconnect to the top of the can for carbonation and a dispensing hose.

[woody558]

I tried this, and water leaks out everywhere.

[lowercase]

Could I use an O2 regulator for the CO2 canister? (I have a spare one from a welder)

[bjinstr]

Thanks for the great instructable. I built one just like yours, without the inline valve (my regulator has a valve at the output port). The total cost of mine was $102 using: - 10lb tank $20 (Craigslist), $23 to exchange for a full one - regulator $45 - 2 tire valves $2 (Walmart) - locking tire chuck $5 (Walmart) - hose clamps $2 (Walmart) - 10' braided hose $2 (Home Depot) - 1 hose barb adapter $3 (Home Depot) If you haven't done so, try carbonating some red or white wine to make champagne. It works great, just open the bottle over a sink, in case it foams.

[letsapocalypso]

Glad that you're enjoying and experimenting with your system! I've made my own champagne as well...I always get the bottle down to as near freezing as I can, so that it will absorb more CO2, and won't foam as much...

[toomyw]

Nearly a year ago I made my own carbonation system using this guide and some others I found on-line. I have been VERY happy with the results. Everyone who comes over comments on how "fresh" the seltzer tastes. And, during that time i've only purchase seltzer 3 times. And that was for the bottles so I could reuse them. My cost of parts, including shipping, was about $100. I can't remember how much the CO2 fill was, but it wasn't out of line. I can safely say I've broken even over the past year and now I'll definitely be ahead. I made my own carbonator caps, but now I'm looking for possibly buy the commercial ones. This is a great instructable! Thank you for putting it together.

[letsapocalypso]

My pleasure! I'm glad you're enjoying and getting continued use out of your system! I often show it to guests; it's a good conversation piece, and lends itself well to a demo / sampling... My bottles seem to last about six months before they get too wrinkled, but that's my own preference...I suppose you could use them indefinitely... My carbonator caps are still working pretty well; it does seem like the thread on the valve stem may be wearing down over time, but it still seals fully... After posting the instructable, I have since added vertical stripes of hot melt glue all around the cap to increase grip for tightening down the cap...

[pbasch]

I have an old-fashioned seltzer syphon that takes those small CO2 cartridges - not a bad deal at around 33cents per cart, but I'm considering a system such as the one described here. But I like the seltzer bottle! Has anyone worked out how to charge a syphon with a system like this? You'd need to screw a coupling onto the syphon's valve, and then release a fixed amount of gas... If someone has worked this out, I'd love to know. Thx!

[yenemy]

Thanks for the great how-to! It inspired me to slap together my own, after doing quite a lot of searching for a consumer-level product and only finding the Soda Club.

I did make a few minor changes:

- Pre-made carbonator cap and corresponding hose attachment
- Eliminated the in-line shutoff valve
- Clear vinyl tubing (3ft) versus braided tubing (10ft)
- 2.5lb aluminum tank vs 20lb

This makes the unit a little more manageable for an apartment setting. It also has the benefit of only requiring a flat-head screwdriver to put together.

Later on, I may consider getting a 20-oz paintball tank and an adapter like [http://morebeer.com/view_product/7650//Paint_Ball_Tank_Adapter this one] to make it even more compact, but the cheapest local refill cost I could find was $5.99 for a paintball tank, and $7.99 for a 2.5lb tank.

Using Richard Kinch's calculation of a 20lb tank yielding 1000L of carbonated water, a linear conversion gives a 2.5lb tank yielding 125L, which at a $7.99 fill-up equates to about $0.06 per liter, or $0.12 per 2L bottle.

And just for fun, that's 62.5L per 20oz paintball tank at $5.99 for a fill, or $0.19 per 2L bottle.

I could probably go to a paintball or sporting goods store and have it refilled for much less, but there are a few home brewing locations near me, so I decided to stick with places that -know- their product is going into food.

[Derin]

if its lemonade you can try a little baking soda

[Lee Gee]

Great project - I am looking forward to carbonating lotsa stuff - just as long as I can get it into and outa the soda bottle! One question - the "$12 Screw-On carbonator cap from with ball-lock fitting MoreBeer.com" and the other part - forgot the name - parts KEG710 and KEG580 - are they both needed or does the more expensive part include the less expensive one? The catalog is confusing. It may be too elegant for me but I am interested... Hope someone knows the answer to this - I hate mysteries unsolved.

[Lee Gee]

My third "comment " today. I figure that is would be better to separate topics to cut down on confusion. Has anyone put a dispensing valve on their carbonation bottle? I like the idea of dispensing from a pressurized bottle. It has always ticked me to open a bottle and losing all that nice CO2 pressure - and seeing the bottle go flat after reopening the bottle a few times. The scheme would be to add a dispensing valve to the system as it is in the existing design, but then I wonder how to do that. Maybe someone can figure out how to do that with a clean design. Gotta have a dispensing valve in stainless I guess to prevent corrosion... Anyone feeling especially clever on this?

[Lee Gee]

Has anyone found other containers for carbonated liquids or foods? I saw a great article on carbonating fruits. For that I would need a wide-mouth jar. I am trying to figure out where to find an item like this - that is not expensive. I have been paying at least 50 cents a liter for carbonated water (WalMart) so this scheme of home carbonating looks super dooper!

[tjl]

This is a great tutorial.

I used it to build my own carbonator, which works with glass bottles. I posted the design here and welcome any thoughts you guys have - particularly ideas for how to make it easier to use...

http://www.winslam.com/laramee/blog/_entry/2008/07/26/Advancing-the-State-of-DIY-Carbonation.html

I'm eventually going to do a redesign to eliminate a couple of problems, but the prototype is working pretty well.

[hacknmod]

This looks like quite an ugly industrial setup. How big are these tanks and how do you go about putting them out of sight.?

[finnster]

Just use a 24oz co2 tank from paintball guns. Buy brass eagle brand, pure energy sucks because their tanks break easily.

[greenbriel]

Yeah, it ain't pretty, but you can stuff the tank under a counter as letsapolalypso did, or in a kitchen closet, as I'm going to. I kinda dig the industrial look, b ut my girlfriend will have none of it. She's still recovering from me building prototype pneumatics for 5 haunted houses in the kitchen last year :) The tank is quite a bit bigger than I had expected. Think scuba tank size.

[processhouse]

How to make a carbonator cap -- great demo video on you tube

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OJD0bv9kLAQ

[palegreenpants]

Have you guys considered using highly available and inexpensive CO2 filled paint gun tanks. They are much cheaper, and small enough to fit under anyones counter/sink or just about anywhere. Plus you can fill them at alot of places.

[asdfasdf01]

does carbonated water HAVE to be CO2? why not regular air from like an air compressor? (or bicycle pump for that matter....)

[fusellovirus]

Compressed air would give a similar ratio to "nitro" beers such as Guinness (which uses 80% nitrogen and 20%CO2 to dispense). This gives a very heavy mouth feel and less of the tangy taste that cones from dissolved CO2. By comparison Guniess has less sugars in it than most American lagers (Budweiser, etc) but feels much fuller because of the nitrogen. I've often thought nitrogen would be great with something like a sweet strawberry flavored drink...one problem though, nitrogen dissolves poorly into water and therefore requires a special inline injector to keep it in solution.

[asdfasdf01]

oh......................

[lemon curry]

different dissolved gases could give you a similar fizzy beverage, CO2 is used most often for drinks because it gives a pleasantly tangy taste (it forms small amounts of carbonic acid when dissolved). Regular air is mostly nitrogen; I have no idea how this would taste. Whipped cream canisters use Nitrous Oxide as a propellant, which tastes a little sweet (sour isn't what most people think when they think "whipped cream", which is why they don't use CO2. Plus the acid might curdle the milk proteins.)

[static]

Can you lease the bottle for CO2 like you can for oxy/ acetylene? That should free you inspection date hassle. Might be something to look into and compare cost.

[greenbriel]

Wow - I've been using this for 2-3 two-liter bottles a day since I built it at the end of July, and the fill gauge on the tank hasn't budged a bit. At this rate I'm going to have to return the tank full to avoid having it go out of date! Tradergordo is absolutely right - don't bother with a new tank (like I did) - you will lose it first time you take it to the gas house. Wish I'd read your comment first Gordo! NEXT UP - I'm sick of shaking these bottles - let's brainstorm an agitator. I have a couple of 1/4 hp high rpm motors around here somewhere, I need to figure out some kind of shaking rig and bottle holder. Any ideas anyone? That would be way slick. Cheers, -Gabe

[gbosbiker]

wire up 2 motors with 2 gears on pin is off center to give the shaking power (for quick little aggressive shakes use a small gear and for slower big shakes use a larger gear) them and design a clamp to hold the bottle in place, turn on the motors and boom! shaking. the motors would obviously clamped down REALLY WELL so it doesnt spaz out and flop around like a fish out of water. the bottle would go back and forth as well as up and down so it would be a good replacement to the shaking by hand. you could add throttle to the motors, a bunch of things to give the best results.

[greenbriel]

Agree entirely with clamping down really well. Might not even be enough - I was once using Dayton motors from Grainger with offset weights (a few fender washers) to shake a chair for a haunted house - ripped the motor right off the welded base that it came on and (fortunately) chopped through it's own cord!

[gbosbiker]

that it what the throttle is for. to control the speed. if it gets going to fast slow it down. going to slow, speed it up. are the motors really strong?

[greenbriel]

They were 1/5HP - pretty strong and high rpm... I did do another thing for the haunted house (fake shaking water heater) where I used a motor, throttle, and controller made for an electric scooter. That might be a better idea...

[gbosbiker]

worth a shot

[letsapocalypso]

Alright...in the interest of becoming Kings of Convienence, what about modding a pneumatic paint shaker to do the work for you? <br/><br/><a rel="nofollow" href="http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=94605">Check this one out from Harbor Freight</a>...it operates within 40-70 PSI, so theoretically you <em>could</em> take the pressurized CO2 as is from your regulator output and run a line into the shaker...<br/><br/>Thoughts?<br/>

[greenbriel]

Nice!! What a great solution. Here's me thinking I'm going to have to run a nasty, noisy electric motor, and this'll run right off the CO2! I wonder how much gas it'll use. Not that that seems to be too much of a problem. I'm going to try the diffuser/jet nozzle method first, but this is next up if that's fruitless. Thanks guys!!!

[hacknmod]

You can do this...a shake free" design is possible. A small tube with a small orifice extending down from the cap will generate a fine mist of bubbles which will increase surface area. The extra trick is to provide a small exit hole at the top of the cap for excess CO2. Essentially the CO2 flows through and some gets exhausted i.e. not as efficient as shaking but still not bad and you have tons to spare. Keep in mind that anything other than water can affect performance and clog the jets. Patent searches will show you all the details-most of these are long expired but I don't recall the numbers...who can?

[greenbriel]

Ooh, now that's awesome. I looked at the "soda club" machine that LowEnergy mentioned below (glad I had enough energy to make my own ;-), and it looks like that works the same way. I wonder if an aquarium bubbler stone would have the same effect, or would that limit the flow too much... I guess it's be pretty cheap to try it and see!

[hacknmod]

Aquarium aerators vary a lot. The better ones are ceramic, not those ones you see which look like compressed sand but actual fine pored ceramic. I don't think they can take too much pressure however so the gas won't be forced down into the beverage unless the stone is run to the bottom of the bottle. Another advantage of a nozzle (orifice) type is that the bubbles blast through to the bottom of the beverage and then rise up, making two passes through the beverage and doubling the dissolution amount. In addition, the stones do tend to plug after some time and require cleaning in some type of lime remover etc. Further they may not be as hygenic because all of the fine pores can hold on to impurities until the unit is cleaned in a solution as mentioned. Certainly worth experimenting with however. Using no aerator or a fine nozzle would not stop it from working, but it would just take that much longer and waste that much more gas. All you really have to do is provide an exit port from the bottle with a valve that pops open at some safe level -perhaps 35psi for example. With this in place, you just run the gas through for awhile and the time to saturation will depend on the rate of CO2 going in and the surface area ie bubble size when it contacts the beverage.

[greenbriel]

Sounds like the nozzle is definitely the way to go. I have some 1/4" od pneumatic tubing with quick connects - I'm thinking if I melt the bottom of a piece of that, and drill a tiny hole through the melted part, that might work. Have to also see if I can rig a regular pneumatic quick connect to attach to the tube through the cap... working on this today - will let you know how it goes. Thanks for the great tips. -G

[hacknmod]

The nozzle will be the tricky part. I am not sure how to make that. A drill hole may be too big. I am thinking 1/64" or smaller. Give it a shot though. Another option may be a Venturi shape -a restricted region of a tube with a side hole. This would cause a vacuum as the gas passes by and suck beverage into the hole aiding the mixing of the two -just an idea that may ot may not work.

[hacknmod]

Just to add: The 35 psi estimate is just that, I am not sure if that low of a pressure is efficient. I do know that a bottle of coke at room temperature like that on a store shelf sits at 50 psi so that may be o.k. too but then you never know for sure since reusing the bottles dozens of times is likely to weaken them. Soda club uses thicker bottles than what you find at the store. In some European countries,soda bottles are returned, washed and recharged. I have one from Denmark. I weighed it and it is about double the weight so roughly twice the thickness as ours. Besides Soda club, some vendors also sell these heavier bottles -may be worth considering if you want to allow for a higher charge pressure. Look forward to hearing how it goes. When using a soda

[breitung1]

here's a continuous feed (no shaking) seltzer system.

http://members.aol.com/gravikord/seltzer.html

we need to reverse engineer!

[LowEnergy]

For anyone who likes this idea but doesn't want to spend quite as much money or do as much construction, check out the soda club machine. $100 for a setup that's ready-to-go. I've been happily using mine for a couple of years now.

(That said, it's way cooler to follow this instructable and make it yourself.)

[letsapocalypso]

Soda Club is a good retail option for those who are a bit uneasy about doing DIY projects...As mentioned above, I had been toying with the idea of buying a home carbonator, but I was leery of the idea of being locked into a proprietary, closed system of buying refill cartridges from a retail manufacturer;

I looked into Soda Club's "Re-Order Supplies Page," here... It turns out that it's FAR more expensive in the long run to re-order supplies than to use a 20lb tank yourself...$0.83 per 2 liter vs. $0.04 per 2 liter...but there's definitely the convenience factor.

[LowEnergy]

Yes, comparing the cost per liter is useful, and it's certainly cheaper per liter to follow your instructable. I should have been clear that it's only the up-front cost that's less with the soda club. A refill of their cylinder costs $20 ($40 for two; $60 for three). They claim 110 liters per cylinder, but we could also compare on CO2 cost: I looked on my cylinder and it's 33 oz (about 2 lbs). And you say you can get a 20 lb cylinder refilled for $15! So that's more than ten times cheaper. As for what it is per 2-liter bottle, you say 1000 liters per 20 lb CO2; they say 110 liters per 2 lb CO2. So those are pretty much in line. That would actually make your cost $0.03 per 2-liter bottle, and theirs $0.36 per two liters ($0.18 per one of their one-liter bottles). To me, that's cheap enough that I'm not worried about it (still much cheaper than supermarket seltzer), but the the cost would add up to be more in the long run if you use a significant amount. For example, if you use a liter a day, the savings will make up for the additional up -front cost in less than a year.

[tradergordo]

online hereI'm building mine now. One thing I found to save money was to buy a used tank. You are probably going to lose it on your very first refill anyway, so why bother buying a new one? You can find used 20 lb. tanks on ebay for around $70 with shipping, but for an even better deal, post on your local craigslist - that's how I got mine, several people responded to my want ad. I ended up with a FULL 20 lb. steel tank for $50. I bought a good condition brand name regulator on ebay for around $20 shipped, and spent $20 for the home depot parts, $1 for the harbor freight thing, and $20 for 20 monkey grip valves (found them online here for 65 cents a piece, or almost exactly $1 with shipping when you buy 10 two packs). Not sure I will ever use 20 of these at the same time, but hey I'll have backups if I need them, and I can now carbonate a ton of the small soda bottles for taking on trips or sticking in the cooler or whatever.

So for $111 this is a pretty good deal and a great project. You can also buy a very inexpensive adapter for your CO2 tank that will enable you to fill paintball gun tanks.

I would also like to figure out how to carbonate for glass bottles (that are capped with regular bottle caps). I think they sell tools for doing this but I still need to research more (from what I've been told you carbonate first in another container and use some attachment to your CO2 tank to purge the bottle of air and transfer the carbonated beverage to the bottles).

[tradergordo]

Another way to save money is just eliminating the inline shut off valve. This is OK if your tank is in a position that is easy to reach, just use the shutoff valve on the tank itself, or on the regulator if it has one built in. This will also eliminate 5 potential sources of leaks (two barbs, two hose connections, and the ball valve itself) and keep the whole thing even simpler (not that its very complex as it is).

[letsapocalypso]

GREAT tips! A couple questions...what was the brand name / model of the regulator, and where did you find the deal on the monkey grip valves? My next carbonation "holy grail" is figuring out a cheap DIY system to dispense soda water via a push-button bar gun or something similar...

[tradergordo]

It's a tap-rite regulator. The link for the monkey grip valves is:
http://www.hardwareandtools.com/invt/u616992
Auto-parts stores also carry these (I know for a fact that Advanced Auto Parts has them and I'm sure others do too) for about the same price when you factor in shipping (1.99 for a two pack at Advanced Auto Parts).

[tradergordo]

Sorry that link somehow was misplaced, the "online here" should not be at the beginning, it should be linked where it appears in the sentence about the monkey grip valves. I should also add that I had to call a lot of CO2 refill places before finding one that did $14 refills on 20 lb tanks. I called 6 places and prices ranged from 14-30. Hydrotest prices for expired tanks also ranged from $15-25. The best place in my area was a beverage company, next best was a medical supply place. I did not find any great way to locate these using the online yellow pages - the two I found there were more expensive. I found a local homebrew discussion site which is where i get the best recommendations - I also called a homebrewing supply shop in the area but their recommendation was not as good.

[Garden State Groceries]

Thanks for this tutorial! I'll study it in detail this afternoon. We had a seltzer machine plumbed in the kitchen growing up. Mom liked to use it to do dishes, she said it got the grease off more easily. It blew a line years ago and I have missed it. We keep the tank chained to an upright ( lolly column ) in the garage under the kitchen. It takes about 6 months to drain a tank with 4 consumers in the home. I'll let you know how it goes.

[JakeTobak]

I would do this in a sec if I knew where to buy Diet Mountain Dew syrup. Or maybe something like Bawls/Red Bull syrup. I assume energy drinks are made the same way as other sodas.

[Garden State Groceries]

We get syrups by looking for "fountain supply" places, or "fountain repair". A gallon of syrup 20 years ago was 14$.

[dchall8]

I think the people you're looking for are the ones who supply snow cone (raspa in South Texas) vendors. Check your yellow pages. Sometimes Sam's Club and maybe Costco have these supplies. I've seen syrup by the gallon (with a hand pump) and in larger quantities.

[dacker]

When on sale, I buy 2 liter bottles of store-brand club soda or seltzer water (funny, they sell both, but I think they are the exact same thing), and mix in Torani-brand syrups (normally used in coffee shops) to make "home made" sodas or Italian soda in uncommon flavors.

Torani, DaVinci, and others, offer dozens of flavors -- both regular and sugar-free. My favorite local restaurant supplier sells it for $3.79 a bottle -- grocery stores are over $5 and a local coffee shop wants $7.50 for the same thing.

My kids especially like raspberry, cherry, and peach soda.

http://www.torani.com

While our low-level of personal consumption does not justify this project, it's a great Instructable!

[greenbriel]

It works! My first instructable project!

I had a couple of pitfalls: first and biggest - I bought a brand new shiny aluminum cylinder, took it to my local industrial gas place, asked them to fill it with CO2. They hauled it off, and came back 2 mins later with a filthy old tank. "There you go". Apparently all these places SWAP your cylinder. He said I could *possibly* get my cylinder filled if I waited a week, but even then it might get lost.

I was pissed at first, but whatever. If you do get a cylinder swap, make sure you check the dates stamped on the tank. If there is just one, the first one will be the manufactured (birth) date. If there is more than one, the subsequent ones are the retesting dates. CO2 cylinders must be hydrostatically retested every 5 years. If the gas place tries to give you one that is close to needing a retest, ask for a newer one, because chances are when you try to take it back next time, they won't take it, and you are out $100.

I ended up not installing the ball valve, because my regulator has a valce at the tank end. I may add it later if I get around to an under-cabinet install. The tank is rather bigger than I expected, so I need to shuffle some stuff around.

The other glitch I hit is that while wrenching the air chuck onto the business end, the whole thing came apart, and kinda stopped wotking. Parts America seems to have a great return policy, so I will return for a new one. In the meantime I'm using a non-locking airchuck which works fine, if a little tricker to hold while shaking.

Anyway, sorry for filling up your comments, but I wanted to thank you again for a fantastic, clear, money and environment saving instructable!

[letsapocalypso]

Glad it worked for 'ya!!!

It can be hit and miss with the local industrial gas places...some can be a bit shady...

I just picked up a tank and regulator for my parents (who are anxiously awaiting their own setup); I happened to be in the San Diego area, so I swung by BeverageFactory.com's retail outlet and picked it up myself...Thanks again for the tip!

You may be able to exchange the broken chuck at a retail Kragen outlet instead of sending it back to Parts America? See if you can make that fly...

My dad actually happened to find a locking air chuck at Harbor Freight (if you don't know about them already, it's basically the 99 cents store for tools...awesome place...find your local one here...

Thanks again for sharing your process and tips!

[greenbriel]

Thanks man! I didn't get the impression that these guys were shady, it really does seem like the straight swap is S.O.P. There was even a customer of their's in there who said the same thing. They don't actually fill the tanks there, they do it somewhere else. Which makes sense as it's actually illegal to refill propane tanks in NY City. Glad Beverage Factory worked out. They seem like a good outfit (thank YOU for the tip!). Did you get the ebay price on the tank? Once I got over my initial shock and realized it doesn't really matter if my tank is pretty (it'll be hidden anyway), I just went with the flow. This project has also given me some ideas for halloween - I'm thinking of a 5 pound tank in a backpack driving pneumatic cylinders.... I'll repay your kindness with an instructable if I get it together. Harbor freight is great. Not the best quality tools, but if you need something specific for a couple of uses ... No Kragen's on the entire eastern seaboard! Have to mail it I guess. No biggie. I forgot to comment on your great video too - very pro, are you in the biz? I have a TV background and still do motion graphics from time to time... Cheers!

[hacknmod]

Looks like a good system if you need to make a lot of soda. I did find another system using baking soda and citric acid at

http://www.inventionsthatwork.com/carbonator.htm

Not quite as cheap to make as your system but still pretty inexpensive compared to store bought soda. It looks like the cost to build is much less but probably a little more effort to run.

[greenbriel]

The cost to build isn't that much less (particularly if you just put a deposit down on the tank), AND at a cost of 15c per litre for expendables, vs. 2c per litre for this puppy, AND the extra effort involved, AND the materials you'd need to buy much more frequently AND the cleanup after every carbonation AND the $10 you are expected to pay for plans (hello, what?) I'd say the choice is a no-brainer! Just got back from Home Despot with the materials needed from there, auto parts, CO2 tank and regulator on the truck for delivery today. Hope they get here before 4P so I can get me some gasssss.

[greenbriel]

My girl and I drink almost 4 liters of seltzer a day, at a cost of nearly $90/month! Obviously this will pay for itself pretty quickly! I'm buying a tank and regulator from beveragefactory.com (hint - their prices are lower on ebay than on their website, and they will pricematch), and the rest of the stuff locally. My local industrial gas place will refill 20lbs of CO2 for $16, but they wanted $215 for the tank ($90 at beveragefactory), and $5.50 a month for the rental, PLUS a $100 deposit! Thanks for the awesome instructable, I'll let you know how it goes!

[letsapocalypso]

Thanks for the tip! I added your beveragefactory.com info the the "procuring your parts" section...feel free to drop me a line with any questions when you're building your own!

[greenbriel]

Thanks LA! I ordered everything - got the tank for $89.95 ($16 cheaper) and the regulator for a buck off. Auto parts are on their way from partsamerica. Another good thing about the CO2 tank is it may well get me using all my beer brewing equipment again. All the bottling was a pain, and with the CO2 tank I'm halfway to a keg system Will keep you posted, and thanks again.

[HamO]

Very well done instructable with great pix. I drink a lot of club soda and will look into build this for my house. Way cheaper than store bought bottles! Thanks for sharing!

[dchall8]

While this is not a completely new Instructable, there are some ideas that make this one more practical than the others. Making your own "carbonator" (the cap with a valve) is cool. I think I would want to be able to see the gages at all times so maybe I would not blow up a bottle in my face if a valve malfunctions. Moving the tank to make the gages visible would complicate everything. If you wanted to be still more anal about your carbonation, as long as you are burping the bottle before filling it, you could also purge the fill tube of air before connecting to the cap. Just open the in-line valve a little and blow the air out with the CO2. We had to do that in a chemistry lab in college for something. I've thought about making my own soda fountain at home, but came away with a cost of syrup per 100 ounces of final drink to be about the same as I buy it for at the gas station. The investment in hardware would be about $1,000 so I never got around to figuring the cost of CO2. I don't know where people drink plain carbonated water, but I've never heard of it. I thought it tasted kind of nasty when the syrup ran out at the fountain.

[letsapocalypso]

Thanks for posting your thoughts! Regarding the gauges, I anticipated checking the readings every week or so to monitor my remaining psi of co2 in the tank, and I'm also curious to see if the regulator fluctuates in output psi... About the taste, I've had tap water come through the fountain drinks when I was expecting syrup, and it was definitely nasty. We use filtered water in our home system, and it tastes just as good as regular filtered water would, but just with bubbles. We often add a twist of lemon or a splash of orange juice, as well...it's also good for mixed alcoholic drinks! I considered purging the line of air before filling the bottle, but that would involve placing a schrader valve (or small screwdriver/blunt object) to depress the air chuck each time I filled a bottle...The five feet of fill-tube before the inline shut-off valve remains airtight, while there may be some regular air backflow into the latter 5 feet (60 inches) of tubing... I was curious as to how much air ended up in the bottle from the latter part of the tube, so I pulled out my old geometry formulas that were beat into my brain during high school; using Pi x (internal radius of the 1/4" diameter tube) squared x 60 inches of tube, it turns out that there's less than 3 cubic inches of air in the 60 inches of tubing after the valve, which is negligible considering that Richard Kinch (the carbonation guru whose page I listed on the front page of my post) wrote that in his experiments, there was a full 6 to 8 LITERS of CO2 dissolved into each 2 liter of soda. Hard to believe, but that's what he claims...

[dchall8]

"Well DUH," I said, slapping my forehead with my hand. You won't have any air in your line with that kind of valve. It's sealed at the very end and the contents under pressure from the inside. Sorry I was misleading there, heh, heh.

[bleachworthy]

mm, ok. that makes more sense . I think I'll try this out, but with something like, cranberry juice. that would kick ass.

[Reverend Irreverent]

This thing is freekin' awesome! I'm totally making one next weekend. Nice video, and thanks for the links to the parts!

[letsapocalypso]

Glad you dug it...feel free to drop me a line if you have any questions while you're making yours!

[bleachworthy]

So, in my ignorance, I have failed to realize how this is healthier than just plain water. can anyone explain this to me?

[letsapocalypso]

No worries...above, I posted that "as kids, we always preferred it to regular tap water, it makes a great mixer, and is much healthier than soda..." In terms of the quantity of water that I drink each day, I've found that I'm more inclined to drink water if it's sparkling, and drinking like a camel is apparently healthy to us human folk...

[lloeb86]

I think he meant that sparkling water is healthier than other carbonated drinks, such as pop.

[xsmurf]

That's very nice. I don't buy much carbonated drinks, not because I don't like the bubbles, but because most of them are awful. Carbonated water is overpriced, so I end up not drinking much. This would be a nice compromise, and in the end much healthier!