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One day I noticed that the humble Propane or LPG gas bottle is pretty much an exact large-scale version of a Lego Mini-fig head. So I decided to cheer up my BBQ bottle with a little Lego lovin'.
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Signing UpStep 1Paint your Gas Bottle
Starting with a basic LPG/Propane gas bottle, give it a wipe with turpentine to remove any grease and dirt, and then spray it with yellow paint.
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In Australia at least the answer is YES!
Here's Happy Gas Bottle being refilled at Ray's Outdoors in Adelaide, South Australia. It really made the day of the guy refilling it.
Cheers, Icedvovo
Our regulations allow for the painting of gas bottles, and as you will see from the photo, they come standard in a variety of different colours. As for climate, Adelaide enjoys long, hot summers with extreme temperatures. We often have heat-waves of over 45c (113f), and we'll quite often have two weeks over 38c (100f).
Even under these conditions I have never heard or read of a gas bottle having any issues because of the colour it was painted. And surely if that were the case, they would change the colours allowed, which the haven't.
As I said, your local regulations and climate may differ.
Cheers, Icedvovo
The first thing that came to my mind was to do some sort of Ideal gas law equation to determine what the pressure would be at a given temperature. Propane is not an ideal gas so this wouldn't work, but I did fine this link to be pretty interesting concerning propane:
http://www.elyenergy.com/media/SNG/Downloads/9-Other%20Downloads/Reference%20Data/CO37.pdf
Looking at that chart, and knowing that LP with a suspended layer of gas on top of the tank indicates that at any given temperature the pressure remains constant. Se we can determine from the table that if the internal temperature of the tank reaches 140 F, the internal pressure will be 290.3 psig (this applies at sea level only, but small variations shouldn't matter)
The DOT typically specifies a minimum 4 times the service pressure (~240 psi) for the burst pressure (allowing 960 psi before the tank explodes, at a minimum) I do not think you would have to worry about the tank bursting because most likely the pressure relief valve (if so installed) would activate well before then.
Rather than go into a lot of detail about possible scenarios, we can examine the outcome of a test of various tanks and their conditions according to the report found here:
www.propanecouncil.org/WorkArea/DownloadAsset.aspx?id=3326
This report actually indicates that the most common mode of failure in a LP tank is corrosion! If anything, painting your tank should prolong the life regardless of the color you choose (of course, you can't paint the inside of your ank, so if there is corrosion there, the benefit of tank stress reduction due to extra paint on the outside of the tank will be negligible). In the conclusion, only tanks that failed the visual inspection actually failed below 1200psi. I would think in a temperate climate (or any climate on planet earth), you would have trouble getting the internal pressure of the tank to 1200 psi.
I'm not saying that it's legal to do so, I'm just saying that the facts in the report indicate that there is no chance of harm from painting your tank. All the risk is in faulty or damage tanks and valves to begin with. So if you start with a new, clean tank (or a tank in good working order)... paint away.
Our family occasionaly buys the home helium tanks, when they run out, you toss them in the trash. So why not do this project on an empty tank that's gona get thrown out? Then you can put it on display instead of under your grill.
Personally I don't think that it would cause much of a tempeture difference if you painted it on a live tank. But this sounds like an up and comming urban myth so I suggest someone submit this thread to the mythbusters website. I'm sure they would _love_ to play with exploding tanks.
Propane tanks are white and reflected to reflect sunlight better to prevent the gasses / liquids from heating up.
1> Spraypaint propane tank
2> Tank no longer reflects enough light
3> Tank heats up more in summer
4> This causes the release-valve to leak propane much much more frequently to prevent an explosion.
Aftermath:
Either you will have a Lot less propane for your buck due to leakage, Or your valve will fail much quicker, Causing the tank to rupture and explode.
Most propane tanks aren't in sunlight. It recommended not to put Propane tanks in sunlight.
1> Put it in the shade
2>Relax
Aftermath:
Problem Solved.
Whenever propane tanks are discussed on forums, armchair technicians such as you invariably show up, who have never picked up a tool and actually built anything.
Think about it: If what you wrote were true, every time people brought a few disposable propane cylinders with them in the trunk on a hot summer day's camping trip or picnic , they'd have exploding cars left and right.
This project is safe. Naught to worry.
Unless:
1> Spraypaint propane tank
2> Nothing Happens
Aftermath:
The tank lasts for years because you know that propane tanks should be stored out of direct sunlight no matter what color it is.
I think the yellow shown here is of similar tone.
Good thing to be aware of, though. Don't go paint your tanks black.
AND, even if it did vent gasses, and those gasses found an ignition source, your result is a flaming jet out of the side of the tank, not a Walker Texas Ranger style explosion. This can cause fires, but the possibility of explosion is incredibly remote.
If your tank valve leaks, by far the most likely scenario is that you try to start your grill and you don't have any propane left. After a few times filling it up and finding that your tank runs out too quickly, you'll probably (GASP) have to get another tank.
Color of the tank does matter. its a matter of safety, federal law, and state law (of those in the US). if you paint an LP Tank black, and its in a car, or out in the sun (not that it should be) it will rapidly heat up. the boiling point of LP is -44*F. this means it doesnt take much to light it on fire. Not only that, but LP ALSO expands to 270 Times its original volume as a gas. this being said, if you take 1oz of LP and just set it free, it will become 270oz of gas. thats just enough gas to do some damage. as the tank heats up, it expands RAPIDLY. if you paint the tank a color that its not meant to be painted...first off, the DOT will more than likely fine you (in the US), and the place you take the tank to may not fill it...thus...Black paint+SunlightXRapid uncontrolable Expansion=Relief Valve activation, a big headache and the possibility one hell of a fireworks show.
Mistwalker, the statement you made about the tank leaking is highly incorrect. your not taking into account the amount of gas that has leaked into the atmosphere...when that gas ignites, it will cause enough blunt force trauma to the tank that it will cause a rupture in the tank, contributing to the explosion even more.
Also if you paint the tank, you will be painting over very important relief holes that make it very difficult to judge when the tank is full. I would know. i pump propane for a living...its best just to keep the tank the color it came because it then maintains the legal specs. that your country's and state's law designates.
but like i said before, its mostly about safety, state, and federal US DOT law.
BUT in the support of the painting of tanks, as long as the color of the tank is a light color it will be fine.
Also, while vented propane could presumably come to the right mix to cause an explosion, that situation would be quite unlikely, unless you were keeping your tank in an enclosed space. If it were outside, it would have to be a very bad leak to put enough propane in the air to achieve the correct mix for a proper explosion. I would still say the risk of explosion is quite remote, which was the claim I made before. Also, I've seen a ten gallon propane tank hit with an incendiary .50 cal BMG round. This is a tremendously powerful round, and it ignited the propane. It made a pair of very large holes in the tank, and quite a lot of fire, but the tank did not come apart from the shot, or the jets of flaming propane. I supremely doubt a propane leak igniting would cause the tank to rupture, unless something was wrong with the tank already. I understand there weren't gasses leaking already that were ignited, and that it's not the exact same set of circumstances, but the amount of energy that was put into that tank was tremendous, and the tank held up remarkably well.
Regardless, my comment was addressing someone who was freaking out about how painting your propane tank yellow will cause a giant fiery explosion, which is nonsense. Tanks come in yellow and orange and blue in various places.
The evidence your looking for as far as pressure building up is right in my original post....its the Temperature and expansion of the LP. thats enough to prove a point. with the new relief valves and OPD (Overfill Protection Device)system, the likelyhood of enough pressure building up to cause a problem is minimized, but not completely gone. therefore it is still VERY much possible for it to happen...for those who live in canada, or alaska its wont be an issue for them because it gets so cold. so a tank painted a dark color wouldnt hurt them. if you live in a desert area, it wouldnt really be beneficial to you to paint it a dark color (plus, you lose propane cause of expansion).
Yeah, i saw the video your talking about...the round they used isnt all that. civilians cannot get their hands on a military grade .50 cal round that has the capability of blowing up a propane tank...but check out this video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MjUMF7cXjx0
dont mind the name of the video, they dont know what they are tanking about. thats a 20lb tank their using. by the look of the mountains, it looks like they are in the hindu kush mtn range (they are military contractors therefore have the connection to the good stuff) because i have seen exact pictures of those with some friends who are deployed right now.
BUT yes i understand what your comment was about. it wouldnt hurt if it was yellow, orange, possibly blue. but its entirely up to laws &what regulations state. the little amount of black paint on this tank wouldnt be enough to cause a significant problem anyways.
.50 BMG is .50 BMG. That's the same caliber used in your video. There's no difference between civilian .50 BMG and military .50 BMG, except when the military does fun things like make tracer rounds and incendiary rounds. The rounds in both these videos were incendiary, which is military ammo. They also make armor piercing, which is either steel core or steel sabot, but that would actually do less damage to the propane tank, as it would pass through more cleanly, and transfer less energy to the metal of the tank. Also, the aftermath of your video shows the tank intact except for the (sizable) hole the round made in it.
As far as the .50 round. i know ALLL about them. i am a veteran and my job was to issue and recieve ammunition...i could tell you all about them...first off, there is a BIG difference between Mil spec .50 and civilian grade bmg...that is this...MILSPEC .50 is made to NATO specifications, and in the US, a civilian CANNOT get their grubby hands on them. a MILSPEC .50 is designed to really put a hole in something...civilian grade is not. A MILSPEC .50 will cause severe internal damage to any living creature just by wizzing by...not even hitting the target...
MILSPEC also (from what i have counted) has at least 25 different varients of the round...the basics ALL being linked for use in an M2...of those the most common rounds seen are:
4-1 (4 ball to 1 tracer)
AP (Armour Piercing)
4-1 AP(4 AP 1 Tracer)
APT (Armour Piercing Tracer)
API (Armour Piercing Incendiary)
APIT (Armour Piercing Incendiary Tracer)
Dummy
High Pressure Test (just a fancy steel cartridge designed to test chamber pressure when the live round is shot)
Blank (just a pain in the butt cause it jams often and is just a silly waste in my opinion)
HEAT (High Explosive Anti Tank (comes standard with Tracer compound)
And HEATG (High Explosive Anti Tank Guided (Its a brand new smart round but is just coming out)
It is VERY DIFFICULT to tell wether or not the round was API because of all the fire. And API round can be seen hitting its target, and a report is heard from it when it hits. so because of the tank blowing up its impossible to tell UNLESS they showed it in the camera first, for an API round is identified by the tip of the projo being painted silver in color.
Congrats on looking up .50 BMG on wikipedia. The notion that milspec stuff will cause some kind of special extra internal damage by going past is absurd. Anyone can reload the stuff, so even if there is some difference in how many grains of powder are in the cartridge, or a different grain weight on the bullet, you can buy a bullet that weighs the same, and put in the same amount of powder, and you will in fact get the same results, as that's how physics works. The military doesn't shoot special magical bullets. They shoot lead, wrapped in copper, propelled by burning gun powder, aside from specialized rounds for specific jobs, like armor piercing, tracers, and incendiary, which we have mentioned already.
The bullets that shot the tanks had to be something that was burning, like tracers or incendiary, because shooting a tank with regular bullets doesn't cause the gas to ignite. It just causes a leaky tank. That's why I said it was incendiary. Armor piercing or not matters hardly at all, as any normal .50 BMG round would go through both sides of a normal propane tank. The armor piercing round would likely just make a cleaner hole, in fact.
yeah, great...someone can re-load the crap...WOOP DE DOO Bazel!! they still cant get their hands on true projo's that the military has...the MOST a civilian would be able to get their hands on is an aftermarket, low qual. tracer projo...which is NOT classified as an incendiary.
And your wrong about ANYTHING needing to be an incendiary round...ill have you know (oooohh snap..here comes a physics lesson), that as a .50 travels through something many things can/will happen (NOT APPLICABLE TO .50 CAL MUZZLE LOADERS BTW)...1) The round is traveling so fast that it compresses the air around it very rapidly...this causes immense heat. 2) as the bullet travels through a solid object, this too also creates heat due to friction not only that, BUT THE BULLET WILL ALSO PRODUCE A SPARK which is not only quick, but also VERY difficult to see w/o the aid of a high speed camera (depending on the time of day...with the bullet and the air around it already hot enough to make something called a SPONTANEOUS spark, and also instantaneously causes the propane to become a gas. and because the air is around the bullet is already at a temperature to support combustion, the propane ignites. if you dont believe this, refer to all the 'ibles on this site about FIRE PISTONS that use this same principal to ignite a simple piece of char cloth. theres your proof. you cant deny this one.
and BMG dont stand for anything special. it just stands for Browning Machine Gun (which i would assume you already know)
and as far as "magical bullets"...lol...the military really should shoot magic bullets...they have everytihng else...haha (try to laugh...its a little humor to ease the tension.)
lets just do this, agree to dis-agree. you dont need proof to show that it is possible for something can happen (no offense but you sound like you live in Missouri). just accept the fact that it is possible.
You sound like a bright person. imma subscribe to you. blow me away with some projects!!
Your "physics lesson" is not reality based. It is delusion based.
You have no idea what you're talking about. Ballistics do not work the way you think they do.
No offense but you sound like you live in your own colorful, delusional fantasy world.
So, besides being delusional, you are also a hypocrite. Good day, sir, we are done.
here in Philippines, we have a range of colors, mostly light shades.
Propane usually comes in bottles and tanks. Natural Gas is usually delivered by a pipeline; it's a utility like water, electricity, and sewers.
LPG and Propane are the same thing as far I know.
We actually call it LPG here in Australia, but I named it a Propane project to talk to the wider Instructables audience.
I suspect it contains some slightly heavier fractions as well, like isobutane and pentane.
LPG is a term used also in the UK but it covers all gases derived from petroleum including both Butane and Propane. You probably know that they are used at different pressures hence the use of the individual names to distinguish. Butane and propane are interchangeable as long as the correct type of pressure regulator is used for each.