Refill Disposable Propane Tank from a Standard BBQ Cylinder

I refill my littles 1 pound propane bottles from a big one. I'm going to show you how...

Step 1 Safety First & Disclaimer

Disclaimer : Whenever there is propane there is risk. If you decide to refill your propane tanks yourself, you have to understand that you do it at your own risk. These cylinders aren't DOT approved for refilling. This means that you can't take your cylinders to the local propane-equipped service station and have them refilled. That's against the law. And refilled cylinders can't be sold commercially. And commercial operators can't transport refilled cylinders across state lines. There are all sorts of limitations and potential liabilities associated with refilling these cylinders. It's perfectly legal to refill them for personal use, however.

There is some safety precautions that you have to take when refilling your disposable propane cylinders and you will need to handle it properly and observe all the best-practice safety protocols.

#1 Always do the refill process outside.

#2 Never smoke during the entire process.

#3 Be sure there is no open flame in the area.

#4 Wear safety glasses and protection gloves for added safety.

Again, I am not responsible for any accident that can happen when you refill your own disposable propane tank.

Comments

[baudeagle]

FYI, here is a news story about the deadly consequences of refilling non-refillable tanks.

http://minnesota.cbslocal.com/2012/02/06/1-dead-1-injured-in-polk-county-garage-explosion/

[wtkjd]

This is illegal in some states - either as a citable infraction or a crime. Be sue to check your local laws before attempting this process.

[usleatherneck]

I'm this practice causes cancer in California. :)

[Jeffster]

Just found this link.... not sure about the availablity of these but it looks like a solution down the road.

http://www.allpropanemowers.com/v.php?pg=232

[johnsned51]

OK, bottom line. I'm a propane supplier and I honestly hate this idea, but I'm also realistic enough to know that people will still do it, whether I like it or not.

#1 Do not, under any circumstances, a cylinder to 100 %! Propane has a high temperature/volume expansion rate. Too full when cold means it pops off when it goes hydrstatic (liquid full @ high pressure). 85% MAXIMUM!!!
#2 propane expands at a ratio of 1 to 270 when it goes from a liquid to vapor. Stack up 270 of those little cylinders in your trunk behind where your kids ride in the car on a good hot day.
#3 There is a technical explanation as to why you find half full 1# cylinders in the forest, I mean besides the fact they are wasteful litterbug jerks.
It goes like this, If you know the physical properties of propane, you know that propane appliances burn propane vapor. At atmospheric pressure propane is a vapor. At -44 degrees it is a "0" pressure liquid. Pressurize propane in a tank and you can keep it liquid at higher temperatures. Think thermodynamics. Small tanks, small volume, gas cools in cylinder faster, chills gas to -44, no vapor, no burn. No burn, must be out of gas, throw away 1/2 full tank. (yes, I've seen it! Over and over!)
Big tank, big  volume,gas cools slower, doesn't get to -44, burn hotter longer

Better yet, just don't do it. state an federal agencies do'nt write rules to "big Brother" us. They may seem misguided sometimes but they really want us tobe safe

[jcwtexas]

To johnsend51 : why dont you learn how to write. Your negative comment gave me a headache trying to comprehend what you are trying to say.

[AfricanMystic]

Well, Jcwtexas, it's not johnsned51's fault that you can't read and / or have no scientific education. His post was totally readable to me and is not negative. It's informative.

This is a dangerous thing to do. There is a good reason that these cylinders are not rated for refilling. They are designed for 1 use, but are over spec'd for safety. It's that safety margin that you are playing with.

Have you ever seen the sort of explosion and the devastation that one of these can cause, it can easily kill.

So if you’re going to refill, then having more info is very valuable. It could save your life. So if you do not understand the info passed on here, do not refill any cylinders. Or, rather do, and rid the gene pool of yourself.

[oldtimejewelerguy]

I agree with AfricanMystic and johnsned51, I have an adaptor for filling the 1 pounders and I am going to toss it - It is much easier and safer and in the long run probably cheaper to just go and buy the 1 pounders on sale at a discount store!

[snowluck2345]

I don't think this is proper English: His post was totally readable. Legible maybe? or understandable?

[Dodge]

Read it with a Hank Hill voice. It's easier to understand that way.

Jaykaying, Johnsned51, jkjk...
I actually learned something. Thank you.

[pmally]

you know there's a little shrader valve in the side of most of thoes tanks so you can get the AIR out of the tank when your filling it any propane tank has a bleeder valve, that's how you get the tank full even if you had a propane pump to help fill it up

[J57ltr]

It's not a bleeder it is a safety vent for DOT regulations.

[J57ltr]

I spent several days with the guys at Worthington, including their production manager and several of their engineers. It is perfectly safe to refill the cylinders as long as you do not exceed the Net weight of the container. Freezing the containers was laughed at and they said its a waste of time. Just take the net weight of an empty container and add the contents (900 something grams comes to mind, check the label). The containers go through many tests, one of which is after they are filled on a rotary filling station they go into a 140* F bath to find any leakers and to make sure they can handle the pressure. I spoke with the production supervisor and he said he filled his own all the time. He even converted his engine driven bike to run on these cylinders.

Jeff

[pblasman]

your crazy to even think about refilling these tanks. If you make a mistake, your playing with a small bomb.

[J57ltr]

You know nothing of this so you should consider keeping it to yourself. I have worked with Worthington Cylinder, who supplies most all the tanks discussed here. Even Colman buys from them from Worthington when they cannot keep up with supply.

[Danish M1Garand]

Ok, but you drive a car with 30 gallons of one of the most flammable liquids around. Use your head don't try to fill any tank that you don't feel 100% about.

[KATRAZ]

I've been refilling small tanks for years and never any problems. When you refill them, you are refilling to a pressure that is

[magickaldan]

Alright Guys if you feel unsafe doing this then DON"T do it thats your choice no one can make it for you. But for others have at it, If there is any data showing this is a bad idea then show it but otherwise shut up about how unsafe it is. How many people have gotten blown up from refilling these bottles? anyone... I'm sure there's alot more people out there that do it. The device for refilling them is sold all over the place so it can't be that dangerous.

[RJSC]

Well... I was thinking only in refill one supposedly "non-refilable" baloon hellium tank with compressed air at 10 psi from my air compressor to operate a small air tool for a minute on a remote location. I guess the is no risk using compressed air a 10 psi, but if someone thinks other way, please let me know.
They even seem to be welded.

[isotopej]

You will have much better results renting a CO2 tank from a homebrew store, soda supplier, or beer store. One 5lb tank holds a LOT of gas that can run your tools. You just have to get the regulator of course. I'd check ebay.

[NateHoy]

I imaging that 10PSI would be pretty safe for some time. Putting plain old air in the tank might accelerate corrosion from inside which you won't see, so you'd have to be cautious with the tank over time.

But it seems to me that you could come up with containers that are a lot more portable and easier to use than a non-refillable helium tank at 10PSI. Those tanks aren't spectacularly heavy, but they weigh more than they need to for a 10PSI application.

A mountain bike tire (not just the tube, you need the tire and rim assembly as well) could easily keep 50-60PSI without strain, weighs a lot less, and can be refilled many times. And you can refill it in the field with a bicycle pump.

Heck, you could probably use a couple of mountain bike tires on a cart that would carry your tools around. Get to the job site, hook your air tool up to one of the tires, drain that one, hook it up to the other, drain that one, then use the bike pump to pump the tires back up as needed (and when you're done, so the cart works properly again).

I realize it probably wouldn't carry a lot of volume, but if you can regulate it to your 10PSI the tire would probably last quite some time starting at 50PSI.

[isotopej]

I used to refill the 20lb tanks, and all the new ones have the OPV valve inside. Sometimes the valve would stick and we had to bang the tank on the ground to open it. If I'm not mistaken, the valve closes if you turn the tank upside down so I'm not sure how this would work.

[oakironworker]

Thanks I' have also done this for years. I don't weight them though I go under the assumption that there is not enough pressure in one tank to blow up the other. Once they hit equilibrium the transfer stops. I do it when they are cold in the morning But I will put the big one in the garage from now on to keep it a bit warmer.

[NateHoy]

I'll just point out that pressure is not the only part of this equation.

If you invert the original tank as pictured in the ible, you're filling the tank with pure liquid, not partly vaporized, propane (the liquid settles to the bottom and will flow as a liquid into the recipient tank, much like water). The ible is carefully taking both temperature and weight into account, and they are both really important things you really want to consider when refilling a tank.

Therefore, your refilled tank is going to end up with pure or near-pure liquid propane and a lot less vapor. You need that vapor, it is your expansion space. As the propane warms up, it's going to expand, and the vapor in the tank gives you a place for the pressure to go (it compresses the vapor).

In other words, if you want to use the method of purely equalizing pressures while not paying attention to the weight of the tank, I'd think you'd be a lot better off NOT inverting the 20# tank while doing it. You'll end up with a tank that's a lot less full, but with plenty of expansion space.

I'll let others who know more about such things chime in and maybe I'm wrong, but filling any propane tank with more than its rated capacity (which includes space necessary for expansion) just feels like a recipe for disaster if it ever gets warmer than the temperature you filled the tank at. And inverting the tank means you're putting a lot more liquid propane in the tank than it's rated for.

[JimQPublic]

I agree that it seems there's a danger of leaking or overfilled cylinders. Where this makes a lot of sense is while camping- especially with a big group. We do a group campout twice a year where there are 3 lanterns and a few portable stoves going. Over 5 nights we probably burn through 15 1 lb cylinders. I'm going to set myself up to refill them AT THE CAMPSITE so we aren't transporting refilled cylinders. I'll also bring my digital scale so I can be sure they aren't overfilled.

[NateHoy]

If you're with a big group, wouldn't it make more sense to simply pick up a propane tree/adapter kit and use 20-pounders to start with?

I work on an AT maintenance that can have as many as 20 people in a group (though usually around 10), and we use one of those temporary tarp "garages" as our kitchen. We set solid folding tables down the middle and have propane lanterns on the top of the "tree" and Coleman propane stoves set on the tables, all hooked to a couple of 20# tanks. Then our folding chairs go along the sides of the tent. It gives us a centralized, protected, and comfortable area to prepare and eat our meals and socalize.

Using the 20# tanks directly means we don't have to deal with the hassle of refilling 1# tanks. A 20# tank can run a propane lantern and a couple of Coleman stoves for quite some time.

[twhite101]

How about warming it, then releasing the pressure then do this step. This should make more of a vacuum in this tank.

[GrapeApe226]

how about spending the money for a propane tree and extension hoses that attach to your large tank, then you can run your lantern, stove, tent heaters and the like off of your large tank and stop wasting time with this nonsense of collecting small tanks and refiling them. Here is a link, but I'm not advertising lol. look around the net for your best buy. http://www.amazon.com/Texsport-30-Propane-Distribution-Tree/dp/B000P9CZXQ

[hippydog]

I have one of the propane trees.. very expensive and can be a pain sometimes..

[GrapeApe226]

Wall*Mart $20

yes you have to have some extension hoses too, I think refilling partial mini tanks is a pain too. you have to weigh the difference in your situation. Everything about camping is a pain except the relaxing by the fire lol

:)

[ddarkeststar]

I think I'd rather err on the side of caution with this one.
In theory it sounds like a great idea but...
Gas go bang make you do big ouch!
For the sake of a dollar?
I mean come on, what's a dollar? It's only fifty pence in english money.
What would you be most likely to cry yourself to sleep over?
Loosing fifty pence or burying the non flame retardent remains of a loved one when it all goes terribly wrong?
You kids play safe now.

[magickaldan]

Here you guys go a legal/transportable refillable tank http://www.mantank.com/green/refillable.htm

[killbox]

A few key points, The laws atleast here only apply if transporting them across state lines like the Author indicated.

My dad uses alot of propane bottles with some propane tiki torches he uses when camping and having parties. hes been refilling them for ten years in a very similar way, no problem to get 5-10 refills on a bottle.

[turbotonic27]

is there any change of the mini tank to explode beacuse it has very high preasure inside during the process ?

[tandem25]

I like this 'ible. I have wondered about doing this for a while. I can't stand to dispose of old propane cylinders that I feel are still useable.
However, As a man who works around EXTREMELY flammable and explosive chemicals and who has had years of experience inspecting critical safety items and as a firefighter I'd like to voice my opinion for anyone thinking of attempting this.
PLEASE, inspect you cylinders carefully. Look for ANY rust spots. Escpecially under the base, as moisture can collect and cause corrosion. If there is any sign of corrosion please dispose of the bottle properly. Corrosion is a sign of a weakening of the metal and could cause catastrophic failure. This can and does happen at very low pressures, as well as high.
This also goes for dings and dents.
This seems to be a very good way to re-use the bottles, just please be safe.
Don't forget your safety glasses.

[rvirag]

Chilling the cylinder is better than releasing the pressure. Releasing the pressure wastes gas, causes pollution and a fire hazard. Unburned propane is heavier than air, and its release contributes to ozone production, which eventually adds to global warming. Chilling the cylinder is safer and conserves propane gas.

[rangerman2889]

It's the lack of ozone that is causing global warming. thats why ozone depleting agents aren't used as propellants in cans anymore.

[jrsuperstar]

Haven't you heard.. the earth is now in a cooling cycle.

[martynbiker]

its 96 degrees in my back yatrd at the moment, I live in Los Angeles.... COOLING CYCLE MY HAT! roflmao!

[macruadhi]

Propane is non-toxic, non-caustic and will not create an environmental hazard if released as a liquid or vapor into water or soil. If spilled in large quantity, the only environmental damage that may occur is freezing any organism or plant life in the immediate area.
AND
Propane is not considered a greenhouse gas.
source:http://www.propane101.com/propanegreenenergyfuel.htm

And my addition: Propane occurs naturally in the atmosphere, I believe, much like methane, which is a greenhouse gas.