Yellow Dots of Mystery: Is Your Printer Spying on You?

why could not you just print a blank page many times thru different printers ( or print in white something like a period). running it thru top first , then bottom first then thru other printers, it would be hard to tell which printer made which mark making it hard to tell exactly where each mark came from

Just a very simple, basic question for you guys; the identification dots printed on home printers..... are they all yellow, in every brand of printer? because if that is the case then... why can't one just adjust the yellow ink 100% down in an expensive printer, and in a cheap one where you can not adjust the percentage of each ink color.... just remove the yellow ink container. If a person wanted to make political publications, I'm thinking that the lack of yellow ink would become a political statement in and of itself; wouldn't it?

If the publication had only red, purple, blue, and black, but NO yellow, and as a result, no green.... then that itself would be a political statement. so, like I said, why not just "turn off" the yellow ink?
ohhhh, and also, Is there anything at all that I own that the government can't track? hummm, I wonder if they can track my toilet-paper too?

Also no red, as red is made from magenta and, you guessed it, yellow :P

i think that if the printer "decides" to add the dots without your order.. even if you set the yellow settings to 0%, it would still print the dots, even with your specific order.. it would be best just to remove the yellow ink container..
in my hp its not possible to do, since the yellow is together with the magenta and cyan..

A typical color laser printer will not print with one of the cartridges missing. Empty, yes, missing, no.

just replace it woith a different colored empty cartridge!

That would be the same as it being missing, color laser printers can identify whether the cartridge installed is t he right color and won't print if the correct color cartridge is not in every slot.

Older models might still print, but most color lasers have been able to identify the cartridge for several years/generations. I checked a website to see if mine was known to do the yellow dots and it wasn't listed because it was too new, but the 2 or 3 prior models from years past that it is based upon are on the list.

Pulling out the yellow ink may work but you should probably test by yourself on the software adjustment.

Now, I have an experiment. If this is the serial number ,then you could read it. But how, is the Big Q.
Think about it, if a friend printed you a sheet and found the number and Googled it. Then the next day you could tell him his exact Printer, Number, Date of Made. Everything.
What would freik you out more, tell you your printers spying on you. Or make them think your spying on them.
Funny.

haHA! no color ink in my printer! take THAT government!

Ha! I have no printer =3

lol me other ink cost too mutch so if I need a print out I print to pdf and then print it at kinkos lol

Cereleste:

Actually, if the printer encodes it's own ID number, it is VERY easy to find out that "printer X" belongs to "Bob Smith".

Every manufacturer's batch number is scanned into the hand held stock readers upon reaching the store. Each individual unit is tracked by the checkout system. Provided "Bob Smith" paid with a credit or debit card (which happens for 98% of all large tech items) the store's own computer system links "Bob's" credit card number to batch number to manufacturers number.

Any person or agency with access to these systems and some initiative would only need to do a few hours work to track a printer directly from the manufacturer to the person who owns it.

Ain't technology grand?

Actually no, the checkout systems generally don't keep track of individual unique serial number except on certain purchases. Most often they only scan the non-unique UPC code when you checkout.

Thus, there may be a link from make and model of product to the credit card, but not any particular specimen of product.

In your country each product, has an individual barcode at POS?
That's interesting. Over in AU each product has the same as the rest of that product. Hence no association with Item Id's/batch number and credit card details. So no problem there.

some products have more than one bar code. the generic one is used to pay for the product and the unique one to identify it in the storage rooms and when shipping

now consider that a single shop does not sell lots of the exact printer. most people buy inkjets and not color lasers so a small or medium shop sells below 100 of the same model. the unique printers can be tracked up to the shop. from there there are only number of people as the number of printers to check and at wish this can be done manually based on other info

the workers at the shop line can be required to scan both bar codes in which case the printer can be tracked down to a single some1

some packages and products also include RFID chip (wireless equivalent of bar code) which is unique too

some pinters setup wizard asks to do 'online registration'. this is another way to get personal data bypassing the shop entirely. the combination of both can link a human to an entire computer (and not just the printer) thru the printer. this applies to many computer appliances not only printers

(removed by author or community request)

(removed by author or community request)

(removed by author or community request)

(removed by author or community request)

(removed by author or community request)

(removed by author or community request)

(removed by author or community request)

(removed by author or community request)

LoL... Oh you make me laugh.
Good day to your sir,. your antics have bought a smile to my face. ;)

any way I could get a transcript of that thread? or would the wayback machine have it?

How's this for a quick and dirty fix? Measure the dot pattern from your printer, then create a random dot pattern of your own using a similar dot size and grid spacing, then print it across your page along with the rest of your design. It won't be perfect but it could irritate the hell out of whoever's snooping on you. Or at least let them know you're wise to them.

The UPC barcodes are all the same, but there are other barcodes some on the printer itself sometimes on the box, that are different. They are a barcoded serial number. Most everything I have purchased that is electronic has a barcoded serial number on it, that is not the UPC that is the same on every one of the same model of the product in question. Sometimes these get recorded with who bought it, sometimes they don't. I have enough identification and stuff though, I have no privacy, but it's by choice. I certainly understand why people would want their privacy though.

What about B/W laser printers.

Welcome to the "post 9/11 age"

You normally purchase items using your credit/debit cards. That is stored data which can be used to track your purchases (similar to Loyalty Cards -all used to collect your private shopping habits and dates and times).

You may not know it - but all credit card companies have a file on your entire shopping profile. Welcome to the "information age".

I have no color ink and I bought my printer at a swap meet 3 years ago. They could never track anything to me if they wanted.

If you were a suspect, they could find your printer.

You can get that blue light free! If you donate $5!

I saw something about this on the news about 3 years ago! This is freaky. Everywhere you go you can be tracked. I wonder how long this has been going along?

Thats really cool.

"It's outrageous that manufacturers make secret deals to compromise our privacy." What privacy? How many times do you send a letter to some one and you do not want them to know who sent it? This is not any different than your IP address being included in an email or saved at a website.

when you print something you expect it to be anonymous unless you intentionally signed it

for love letter (do you really want it to be anonymous ?) you probably just print and its anonymous. for some other stuff you may want to use a generic font / shred the text with babelfish / handle the page with gloves. you sure dont want the dots there

The dot's don't identify the person, right?
Just the printer.
Then this has nothing to do with privacy.
The dots will only tell someone that a XXXprinter printed it, not Bob Smith printed it.

However if you send in your warranty card, your privacy would be compromised. Your choices. Rick that the product you buy isn't a lemon, and don't send in the card. Protect you pocket book, by risking your security. Today merchandise can be trace from factory to retailer. Not a stretch to imagine the trace from retailer to purchaser. I fail to trust that every bar coded item I purchase is not link to my checking and/or CC accounts. Paranoia? Perhaps, how can we know for sure?

bar codes are not an issue - they are the same on all stuff of the same type

you'd better go google on RFID :)

many new printers come now with online registration feature in the setup wizard. im sure this registration includes serial # of the printer and some data from the computer

we have one such printer / scanner combo from HP and the thing is quite annoying (with options only 'now' and 'later' and cannot be disabled. it gets back to startup when you use the scanner)

I know of at one count of the operator being identified and convicted by comparing the operator log with the time stamp in the code.

I serviced one particular color printer that included firmware to recognize currency. We were warned, sternly, during training that we should NOT attempt it. The instructors stated that they did not know how the firmware worked or how it affected the printer. Since it was a network printer it had the capability of reporting such attempts.

Not only that, even my scanner (canonscan lide 90) can't scan currency (tried it Euro). What is the logic in that??? So I can't send pictures of money? I should return it to the shop.

wow ! this story with firmware just shows how the _government_ is paranoid

what make and model is that printer ?

Xerox - I worked for them 33 years. The technology is used in mostly color and all models have something similar. The quality was so good that copies would be accepted by scanners. Something had to be done to prevent counterfeit.

scenario 1

your boss asked you to print some stuff for him with deadline. deadline passed and you did not do that. boss calls and asks whyits not ready. you tell him you sent and thats the mail service fault (and not yours). you sit to print it and remember to write there the date of 2 days ago (to make the show perfect)

boss recieves the mail. he is freaked off how late the docs arrived and shares his rage with a friend. his friend suggests him to check the true date encoded in the dots and decode that using the calculator in the EFF site

scenario 2

you are a journalist who uses the computer for his professional stuff as well as his personal stuff. he prints a doccument that he wants to make confidential so that no one can get on him if the document falls in the wrong hands. the document does

a month ago his daughter married an he printed the invitation letters on the same printer. one of those letters is enough to link him to the confidential doc via the printer serial number

the dots contain information that you did not intend to include in the document you print and you are likely to be unaware of its existence. this is a privacy issue. no need in your name

it may be very complicated to find by incident a titled document printed on the same printer - so it does not look that severe. possibilities become huge when dots meet other info that can be esily crossed with them - like where was batch of printers of model X and manufacture date Y sold - probably available from the manufacturer

lets wait for the EFF guy to explain more

Cereleste, you are correct, the information is just Lexmark - serial number xxxx-xxxxx-xxxxxx and perhaps the date and time. This is not printing out your name, address, and contact information.

11010010110: Both Scenarios are possible, but not really probable. Unless that Boss makes it a policy to look at the dots on each page, then he probably would not even think about it. If someone is using a printer for both "questionable" business practices and personal use, he deserves to be caught.

Base line point is this: If you are printing something out that you do not want to be linked to in any way what so ever, make sure you have an older printer that does not support the dot printing.

Post Script:

This is nothing new. Forensic Detectives used to be able to tell what typewriter was used to create a letter based on the pits in the letters as they stamped into the ribbon and paper. Some companies would even put these pits into their letters on purpose so that it was a form of signature that their typewriter was used.

Comparing apples to oranges. The detectives have to have both the document and typewriter in hand to connect the document to a typewriter, and the typewriter to an user. Same goes for using old school methods used to match a document to a printer. Now only the document is the only thing needed to connect it to a specific printer.

You do realize there are other ways to tell where a document came from... Forensic scientists and the FBI don't need fancy dots to tell them where a document came from. And if every model has a different method of placing dots, it would take more money and time to develop a database of different methods and then cross check the dots with the database.
I don't believe it's worth it. And i guarantee I'll get a scathing reply about "the man" and how "big-brother" is watching, but i still believe that this is the printer manufacturers decision and not the government violating your freedom of speech.