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My "theory"!!!!!!!!!!! Answered

"The world was created in 7 days" Is one "day" for us, one day for God? 1 day for God could be 1 billion years or something.

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gyromild (author)2007-06-05

For argument's sake..if you want to include god in the picture, then god's notion of time certainly cannot be the same as human that are bounded within the universe..

The universe is expanding, faster than the speed of light, time observed within it by humans could be different than the one observed by an entity outside the universe (ie: God). You can dig further on subject (theory of relativity, etc)

If you want to tie the whole thing to your 7 days = 7 billion years theory, just remember that, most people only see thing that they wanted to see..

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royalestel (author)gyromild2007-06-05

Yeah, this is what I'm saying. Actually, according to my scripture study, God is outside of Time.

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benstern (author)royalestel2007-06-05

That is extremely retarded. One can not be outside time.

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frank26080115 (author)NachoMahma2007-06-05

there is no motion of matter outside of time... so it's physically impossible

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Remember... all of the 'facts' about gravity are all only THEORIES!!

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NachoMahma (author)frank260801152007-06-06

. Is God Made of matter? Does God have motion or mass?

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royalestel (author)NachoMahma2007-06-07

.Why do all your posts start with a dot?

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NachoMahma (author)royalestel2007-06-07

. Old habit. It's at the beginning of all paragraphs, not just the beginning of the post. Back In-The-Good-Ol'-Days, most BBSs would chop off any leading/trailing spaces and would oft-times collapse multi spaces to one. The periods faked out the parser. It may still be done, I've used the periods for decades. . I still bar my Zs when I write and I'm the only one that has to read my chickenscratch anymore.

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royalestel (author)frank260801152007-06-07

We don't know that for a fact. So it's physically possible. There's lots of hypothesisness in dimensional math theory, too, my friend.

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royalestel (author)royalestel2007-06-07

Whoops, reread your post. Thought you said there was no matter outside of time. God could stand still outside of time and move through time, then, with what we know, right?

Hehe.

Anyways . . .

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assasin (author)benstern2007-06-05

God can. If it was retarted it would be flailing and twitching accross the room.

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jtobako (author)assasin2007-06-05

It is flailing and twitching across the (chat) room.

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benstern (author)gyromild2007-06-05

Okay... I thought up this exact "explanation" when i was 12 to try to make excuses for a "gods" existence. It lasted about a month.....by then it was way toooo retarded to even consider to be even remotely plausible. the bible was written by man. In that period a day is the same length as the day today. How come he created light before he created the stars? That is basically impossible.

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dsman195276 (author)benstern2007-12-30

it is something called a miracle

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royalestel (author)benstern2007-06-05

Symbolic. Spiritual light. All things are created spiritually first.

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jtobako (author)royalestel2007-06-07

That's Plato, in his works on form.

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royalestel (author)jtobako2007-06-08

I thought Plato's was that there is a spiritual ideal of everything in a spiritual realm and that the height of beauty would be a physical creation that approaches the spiritual ideal? Or was that Socrates or Aristotle? I've always been bad with names. Anyhow.

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assasin (author)2007-06-13

Burn in purgatory.

Infinite universes=anything exists and everything doesen't exist.

I am presedent, I am poor, I am rich, I am dead, the girl I like found out(really), I am vice president, God exists.

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Aeshir (author)2007-06-04

There are ten types of people in the world. Those who can read binary, and those who can't. As for your theory, it's crap. Same with Young Earth Creationism ("Earth was created ~10,000 years ago). It was disproven in the 80's. There was a far away star that they calculated how long it took to for the light to get to Earth, and it was waaaaay longer. Sorry had to say that.

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NachoMahma (author)Aeshir2007-06-05

> It was disproven in the 80's. There was a far away star that they calculated how long it took to for the light to get to Earth, and it was waaaaay longer. . That sounds interesting, but I don't understand how the measurement would work. Can you remember the scientist or institution, maybe the star they used, so I can look it up?

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ok ill put it in simple terms: the star is so far away (2 syllable word) the light travels so slow that your seeing the light that was made 10000+ years ago i think is what hes saying

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> the light travels so slow that your seeing the light that was made 10000+ years ago . One of us doesn't understand what's going on - that doesn't make sense to me. . Maybe if you used monosyllabic words, preferably five letters or less, ...

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the light that was made ten thou years ago has moved so slow ok the eye see by detecting light right? so the light you see now is the light that was made 10000+ years ago

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. I understand that the starlight I see today left the star a long time ago. . For all intents and purposes of us mortals outside of an experimental physics lab, the apparent speed of light doesn't vary all that much. . The sentence "There was a far away star that they calculated how long it took to for the light to get to Earth, and it was waaaaay longer." makes no sense to me (longer than what?) and I was asking for an explanation.

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wait a minute didnt you say it was waaaay longer?

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assasin (author)Aeshir2007-06-04

How is my theory crap? When it doesent smell? 1 day for God could be 1 billion years or something.

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frank26080115 (author)assasin2007-06-04

that is the problem, theists can make up whatever crap they want and think they should get away with it who wrote the bible? man? god? man who was told by god? the last two are clearly physical impossibilities yet you people still insist

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assasin (author)frank260801152007-06-04

Ever heard of string theory?

Infinite dimentions=anything exists

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frank26080115 (author)assasin2007-06-04

then who the fuck made the strings? you are saying god exists in one of the dimensions within the strings does anybody see the missing logic in that?

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jtobako (author)frank260801152007-06-05

You are asking the same people who accept 'omnipotent' and 'free will' at the same time : ) The hypothesis is that god, the all-knowing, doesn't know what we will chose to do and therefor the 'tests' (temptations) he gives are fair.

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royalestel (author)jtobako2007-06-05

Listen, now. People have different definitions of all-powerful and all-knowing. For example, my belief is that God is Omnipotent, meaning, all things that are possible, he can do. In other words "All things are possible with God.' Not things that aren't possible.

An incorrect definition of omnipotent leads to silly things like people asking if God can make a valley without mountains and can God make a rock so heavy he can't lift it . . . yada yada yada.

A lapse of logic on the part of assasin merely makes him human, just like you and me.

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jtobako (author)royalestel2007-06-05

"A valley without mountains" sounds like the grand canyon, and certainly there were many rocks that jesus could not lift : ) Give me a hard one : ) God is omnipotent or not-you can't have it both ways. If he is omnipotent he knows what I will do, eliminating free will which is a basis for sin. It's a variation on a Calvinist argument, but still valid.

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NachoMahma (author)jtobako2007-06-05

> he knows what I will do, eliminating free will . I don't follow. If I put a pig ear in the floor and say "OK," I know what my dog is going to do. I have in no way influenced the dog, but I know what the outcome will be.

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jtobako (author)NachoMahma2007-06-05

Now blame the dog for what it did. Since sin results in eternal damnation, shoot the dog. This is not a learning exercise, this is final (and eternal) punishment. Makes sense to do, right? You knew what was going to happen, set it up, let it happen, and then blamed someone else for it.

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NachoMahma (author)jtobako2007-06-06

. Well, if the dog could understand when I told her that I was going to send her to Hell if she grabbed the ear, it would make sense. . I have to admit that knowing how it ends kinda spoils a movie for me, but who knows what God is up to.

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jtobako (author)NachoMahma2007-06-06

Thats a second part of the problem. It doesn't matter if you know or not-if you don't belong to the right sect, you go to hell even if you never had a chance to convert.

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NachoMahma (author)jtobako2007-06-07

. Most of the religions I've looked at, that have a Hell, have an amnesty program for babes, idiots, and those who have not heard The Word (not necessarily all three by the same religion).

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jtobako (author)NachoMahma2007-06-07

And a lot accept deathbed conversion or final confession. Some internal inconsistencies kill the whole idea, even with a little sugar on top. I've grown tired of self-serving politics, and try to judge people only on why they do things. Following a religion in an attempt to brown-nose god or throw their favored status with same in my face it turns my stomach. And when that turns into an attempt to convert someone (like me)...I would rather get into a verbal fight than a physical one.

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NachoMahma (author)jtobako2007-06-07

> And a lot accept deathbed conversion or final confession.
. I don't get the point. What did I miss?
.
> ... try to judge people only on why they do things.
. Since I don't believe I (or anyone else) can really know what someone else feels or why they do something, I only look at what they do and don't worry about the why. Not that intention/motive shouldn't be considered when deciding punishment/etc, but I don't care if someone does something "good" for the PR, they did something good. Why try to devalue their contribution because of a Why that I don't understand?
. Oops. Got a little carried away, didn't I? I'm not trying to say your way is not the right way, just that I do it a little different.
.
. Well, this thread is getting too unwieldy for me to be comfortable with - getting too hard to find new posts.
. For all of y'all with a little bit of sanity, intelligence, logic, and respect for others - Thanks Dudes! Even though this has been little more than mental masturbation, it's been fun (kinda like "regular" masturbation heehee). Maybe I'll jump back in on a shorter thread. If I get bored, I might come back and play mindgames with the know-it-alls. ;)
. Ciao

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royalestel (author)jtobako2007-06-05

Look, my perspective isn't Calvinist. In my belief all things that are possible God can do. That's ALL things that exist or actually will exist or actually have existed are possible with God. That's my definition of omnipotent. Other Christians have different definitions . . .

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royalestel (author)royalestel2007-06-05

Wait, do you mean Omniscient? God knowing what will happen doesn't mean someone won't violate a law. Just because he knows you're going to violate a law doesn't absolve you from the consequences. Heck, I know if I jump in a lake I'm going to get wet. That knowledge doesn't prevent me from getting wet.

Break God's law = sin. That simple. But you're probably describing something very different than I'm thinking, eh?

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jtobako (author)royalestel2007-06-05

I'm the Calvanist in this case : ) God already knows what is going to happen (omniscient) . God makes everything happen (omnipotent). How can you have the free will to sin if god not only knows what you will do, but set it up so that you would do it?

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royalestel (author)jtobako2007-06-07

Oh, I see. Well, I certainly don't believe God makes everything happen. I believe one of the great miracles God does is to bring something good out of a terrible situation. Anyhow, the term "free will" isn't in the scriptures, I believe. What is in the scriptures is "agency". We get to choose. That's one of the greatest gifts of God to man and he doesn't interfere with it. He has the power to make everybody do perfect things all the time, but he never would. For one thing, it's not right. Satan's the one that wants to enslave everybody and control them. So from my perspective, God could judge our spirits as soon as we are born as to what kind of eternal state would be just, but that wouldn't be just if we didn't have a chance to prove ourselves. So this life became a prepatory state. You choose who and what you will be. God entices and suggests, rewards greatly, but never forces. Satan entices and suggests and if you give him an inch, tries to grab you by the right nostril and ride you like a bucking bronco. Anyhoo.

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assasin (author)frank260801152007-06-04

There is no such thing as 0Dimension because that would mean there are no dimensions; we do have dimensions. There is no such thing as 1Dimension because that would just be a dot; we are not dots. There is no such thing as 2Dimension. The reason is for that is because; if there were, 2Dimensions then there would be nothing there. The reason why this should be is because; if there was such thing, it would still be considered 3Dimension because the flat side would still have length but will have a very, very small measurement of size. There is no such thing as 3Dimension. We do not live in a 3Dimensional world because we would not exist...We need time to exist which is the 4rth Dimension. Without time, we will not have existed at all. This continuous thread of 'no such dimension as this' shows that any dimension cannot exist...There must be an infinite dimensions that we are not in, if you look at the fifth dimension and the 6th, we do not belong to any of them because there is always something missing in that previous dimension. We could say we do not live in a dimension at all but that would mean we live in 0Dimension meaning that we do not exist. Hm... What if, we say that we live in an infinite number of dimensions that all goes on forever and ever and ever...

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royalestel (author)assasin2007-06-05

Look, dividing the mathematical aspects of the physical universe into dimensions is a tool man created (perhaps inspired to by God) to help us understand the universe around us. Your circular logic is not a serious study of the issue of dimensions. Because I declare a variable to be X in my programming does not change the nature of the value it represents .. . . catch my drift?

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NachoMahma (author)royalestel2007-06-05

. I was going to post something similar (though nowhere near as eloquent, even if it did throw in "abstract construct" heehee), but figured it wasn't worth the effort.

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royalestel (author)NachoMahma2007-06-05

Yeah, I almost mentioned abstract concept. Less is more in writing, though.

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jtobako (author)assasin2007-06-04

"Flatland"-read the book. Mmmmm, throgs.....

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