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NAR Competition Answered

The "Not A Rectangle", otherwise known as "Untangle" or simply "NAR" is easily the best single shot in terms of range due to the power transfer at the front. Because this is the only needed feature of the gun, it also makes the NAR very customisable and therefore you can change your NAR to the extreme. With enough work, you could make the gun look however you like.

It's because of this that I had the idea of making this competition. Your task is to create the best looking and most ergonomic NAR. Absolutely anyone can enter, there's no limit on entries, however all entries must comply to these rules:

1) It must use the NAR mechanism, and you must prove it in picture form.
2) It must be your own design. Any NAR's with Zak's handle on them will be disqualified, unless posted by Zak himself of course.

For this competition I will need 2 judges to help me decide, so if you don't want to compete please consider this post instead.

Judges:
The Jamalam
knex gun builder freak
Lowney

The prize for the winner will be a surprise and will be decided privately between the judges and I.

We will be accepting entries up to and including, but no later than 15th September. The winner will be announced on the 20th. You have 20 days, starting from 25th Aug. Oh wait, that's now. Well, get building!

Here is a link to the instructions for the NAR, thanks to silentassassin21 for posting them: http://knexinnovation.net/showthread.php?852-The-untangle


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TheDunkis (author)2010-08-25

What qualifies as Zak's handle? He wasn't really the first to use the thumb hole design just the first to make it popular. Doesn't really matter to me. I won't be entering. The NAR is overkill. Why try to push the limits of a ram rod gun? If you want range, stick with slingshots. Range is overrated anyways. Fun for breaking stuff but not actually that practical in wars.

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ajleece (author)TheDunkis2010-08-26

Excuse me. But the NAR is not overkill. If you want intense range, yes, i agree, build a slingshot. BUT. War wise. If you only stick two bands on the pin in is an awesome war gun. I've had a war with 3 NARs and a BR8. It was really awesome, because the gun is SO simple and with 4 similar guns it was fair. I would recommend it to anyone holding a war with non knexing friends.

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DJ Radio (author)ajleece2010-09-15

2 bands on the NAR goes like 30 feet for me.

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ajleece (author)DJ Radio2010-09-20

Which is good for close range combat.

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DJ Radio (author)ajleece2010-09-20

Not when you have to reload every time you shoot the gun.

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TheDunkis (author)DJ Radio2010-09-20

Agreed.
Let me sum this up again.
Wars happen up close. No exceptions. You're not going to snipe anyone.
Quick repeaters win up close. Shotguns also win if they can hit the first shot or repeat as well.
Thus shotguns + repeaters win wars. Not the NAR

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DJ Radio (author)TheDunkis2010-09-20

I'd disagree. If you were on a team game, you need someone to stay back and operate the long-ranged weapon. You can use it to pick off people who are trying to reload their guns or pick up ammo from the ground.

Also, one time I almost hit one of my friends with the NAR and he was standing around the max range it could shoot. The reason I missed was because it actually shot between his legs.

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TheDunkis (author)DJ Radio2010-09-20

I don't know what planet you're living on but here on earth in the dimension we call reality, there's a slim to none chance of hitting someone with something traveling at a rather low velocity with random flight properties. You can react at long distances to seeing a K'nex piece flying at you. You also have to factor in how inaccurate K'nex are. Even wind can throw it off by a large margin. They weren't designed to be shot. If you can really pick someone off from a distance, I'd find it easier just to rush them so they don't even think about dodging, they'd just run and I'd give them no chance at all.

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DJ Radio (author)TheDunkis2010-09-20

That's why I'd shoot people who were not paying attention to anything except reloading or that guy behind the barrier or whoever. My NAR had sights on it so it was easier for me to aim and shoot people.

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TheDunkis (author)DJ Radio2010-09-20

Then your opportunities are far less than mine when I have a 12 round oodammo pistol with a tilting magazine that I'm constantly keeping loaded whenever I have the time and cover. As soon as I see YOU reloading, I charge you and leave you no other options. I'd like to see a video of you running as fast as you can while cocking AND reloading your weapon.

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user

you don't have to run, just watch out for flying plastic. to be honest I'd use my new shotgun, simply because 3 white rods ae harder to dodge than a single oodammo or red rod, and because it takes no more time to reload than a NAR

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user

Your shotgun is a single shot and it gets mediocre range for a single shot too. NOW THE SWAGBOSS IS THE BEST SHOTGUN EVER BECAUSE ITS 2 SHOTGUNS IN ONE.

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Mace! (author)DJ Radio2010-11-21

How exactly does the second shotgun at the base of it work?

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DJ Radio (author)Mace!2010-11-21

The second shotgun works like a regular single shot pistol, except the barrel is large enough to accommodate 4 yellow rods unlike most single shot pistols.

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Mace! (author)DJ Radio2010-11-22

Oh, ok I see now. I think I will just build the two firing pins with the bolt. Thanks for the quick reply.

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user

but how long does it take to reload? I have never pushed the range of my shotgun either, it can probably get over 15 meters if I pushed it. however you are never going to shot at someone with a knex weapon from that distance any way. the range I gave was a rough estimate of its effective range.

anyway the swagboss has a 45º handle and therefore is yucky

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user

What's your problem with 45 degree handles? They aren't bad, just less realistic which doesn't matter in the world of plastic toy guns.

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why realisticly angled handles are better

straight handles and 45º handles are simple to make, a strong realisticly angled handle takes skill to make.
a realisticly angled handle is more comfortable than a 45º handle IMO
they look better on the gun if built correctly
and they also reduce the length the stock has to be by moving your wrist foward.

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user

Build complexity isn't necessary as more people are interested in a gun that performs well, but has a simple build, like the TR, than a complex build gun that has mediocre performance.

Since when has looks been a good argument outside of replicas?

Length of stock doesn't really matter a lot. It doesn't reduce the length by a lot.

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user

a more complex build makes you not look like a knewbie, and I would never post a gun with mediocre preformance. I'd rather have a TR with a realisticly angled handle than a TR with the original handle or ZAK's handle. just personal preference I guess.

I like a smexy looking gun.

it reduces the number of parts

I notice you had no comeback for point numer 2 ☺

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user

You had more than 3 points?

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user

complexity.
comfort.
looks.
stock length/Ergonomics.

Anyways I have MW2 back now so knex gets put away until later.

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Knarez (author)Fred the Penguin2010-09-20

DOOOD THAT MUST MAKE THE GUN SO MUCH DAMN BETTER I MEAN REALLY MAD SICKNASTY HANDLES ON YO GUN GIVE IT THE EDGE.

Aight but seriously, I'd rather be better at making guns that work well then handles to go on them? That's just me, tho. My view, not the only one. :>

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Fred the Penguin (author)Knarez2010-09-20

true. I just use the angled handle I developed for the TR stock most of the time anyways. and contrary to your beliefs I fit the handle to the gun, not the gun to the handle.

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DJ Radio (author)TheDunkis2010-09-20

That's why I hang around at the back and have teammates that defend my position.

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TheDunkis (author)DJ Radio2010-09-20

Then you're being a waste. A team that's all rushing will be more effective than only half a rushing team and bunch of people who think they can actually sharpshoot with a K'nex gun.

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ajleece (author)DJ Radio2010-09-20

So what? It's fun. I speak fom experience.

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TheDunkis (author)ajleece2010-08-26

RAAAAAAAAGE Range does not win K'nex wars! Have you watched the KI wars? It involves a lot of rushing. It's just not too practical to expect to get a lot of hits from afar. If you want to have a simple war, build even simpler weapons. Otherwise for some more excitement I'd give everyone repeaters. Single shots are boring in my opinion. I don't care if there's less range, they're more effective up close where most people tend to be.

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knexguy (author)TheDunkis2010-08-27

Very true. Guy with single shot shoots at you. You dodge. You run at him and hit him with a ZKAR or TR18 while he reloads. You win. Really what it comes down to is being able to run the difference between the effective range of his single shot and your repeater faster than he can reload his repeater. So the effective range (the distance you can reliably hit a person, not the floor!) of the NAR is around 75 feet at absolute best. For a ZKAR or TR18 it's around 40-55 feet or better. It takes around 3 seconds to reload a NAR, assuming you have the ammo in your hand, let alone in your pocket. So if you can run 20-30 feet in 3 seconds, you should be fine. Fitness wins wars. Come to think of it, this is going in my biography bit on my profile...

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TheDunkis (author)knexguy2010-08-27

Actually I'd further argue that even the ZKAR and TR18 are overkill for repeaters. I suppose they'd be great for closing the distance with single shots and still being as quick as other repeaters but I wouldn't want to fiddle with a turret or a bolt. It would be pump action repeaters and shotguns that would ultimately win wars. I think a simple repeating shotgun could be made by modifying KK's shell into a magazine.

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i do however agree that if fin ammo is not used at a K'nex war then repeating shotguns with a range of 25 to 50ft will win out over its competitors i mean after all its a lot easier to dodge one slow moving oodammo round than 8 white rods at the same time lol

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jollex (author)TheDunkis2010-08-29

Most people can pull the pin back without a pump as fast as with one and with a pump, there's usually a limit to the number of bands you can put on the pin before the pump can't pull it back.

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TheDunkis (author)jollex2010-08-29

Just means people have yet to make a strong enough pump to pin connection. If your hand can pull back a pin in such a way it doesn't break then there's little reason a pump can't. The nice thing about a pump is that it allows you to keep your second hand on the gun supporting it which helps with accuracy and reduces fatigue on your other arm.

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knexguy (author)TheDunkis2010-08-29

True, maybe the most suitable gun ever made so far then would be the 18 round K'sayer.

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range matters when fina ammo is allowed

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ajleece (author)TheDunkis2010-08-26

But i haven' tried a war with repeaters. So touche maybe. But with people that aren't knexers, single shots are fine. In my opinion.

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sprout_less (author)ajleece2010-08-28

I'm with you but I get TD's point. The reason I like nars is they are so simple, when i give my friends a gun they always break it or can't pull the ram back so I could just put 2 or 3 bands and have a decent war.

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TheDunkis (author)sprout_less2010-08-28

Where's the fun in that? Teach them to use guns properly then. It'd be nice to see some variety for once. I was dreaming of the day when there'd be a large scale war and everyone was limited to using guns only they've made with 50%+ their own construction (minus generic things like body construction, etc.) have a fair share of CQC areas and open areas. Heck, stop caring about the quality of your weapon all together. Nerfers and airsofters like having good weapons but they don't go OCD about making it as good as possible. They find it more fun to shoot them and run around than to have the best weapon for the job. I'd happily walk into a K'nex war with just my oodammo pistol.

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sprout_less (author)TheDunkis2010-08-31

Yah like I said I agree with you too and dream of a war like that.

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TheDunkis (author)ajleece2010-08-27

Because K'nex have limited range, I prefer to battle indoors. Eventually range becomes useless because even a weak gun can hit the back wall. If I wanted to teach my friends how to use K'nex guns I'd probably give them something like the Oodassault or MeZak so that they don't have to fiddle with reloading too much. Again, single shots get pretty boring.

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ajleece (author)TheDunkis2010-08-26

I never said range was important. Nar with 2 bands gets about 40 ft. Perfect. BR8 gets same. Perfect. NOW THE SWAGBOSS ON THE OTHER HAND IS THE BEST GUN EVER. I WILL PWN UP AT MY NEXT WAR WITH IT.

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The Jamalam (author)TheDunkis2010-08-25

Zak's handle that everyone uses, as in exactly copies. It's on his own NAR if you look for that, I think it's on youtube.

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lphillips094 (author)2010-10-09

i f the judjing is not over yet, this is my NAR

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dutchwarlord (author)2010-09-24

can i enter my carbine rifle it uses the NAR mechanism both shoots two shots at one.

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The Jamalam (author)dutchwarlord2010-09-25

Show me a picture and yes :D

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ninjusk (author)2010-08-25

I will enter. one question is it judged just on the the look.

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The Jamalam (author)ninjusk2010-08-25

I may change this actually, I think that it should be ergonomics and looks.

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