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Negative Ion Generators Answered

I've been reading up on negative ion generators, and I was going to get one (they're only 12.95), but I was skeptical on safety. 15kv (!) going through my body does NOT sound safe. Yeah, it's probably low current, but 15kv...is alot. How is it on pain? Could it...kill me? I don't know about you, but I only have one life, and its goin good right now, so I don't really want to get rid of it.

Does anyone have experience ith these? Yes, I know about the one instructable about rigging it with your doorbell,, but even they mentioned -and I quote- "...a pretty nasty shock...", so what exactly am I dealing with?

...be specific...be specific...
Oh, and I was thinking of the 12vdc one.

Also, will it jump (the spark), to ANY grounded metal thing?

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LasVegas (author)2007-09-30

Have you ever touched a door-nob after charging your shoes on a carpet? Static electricity is above 20kv. You'd need a fair amount of current to do injury. A heck of a lot more than a 12vdc supply would give.

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en2oh (author)LasVegas2012-09-28

A 12 volt DC supply can easily kill you if you charge the right capacitor with it.
You don't need very much current at all to stop the heart. Certainly mA not amp range.
Nitrous

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John Smith (author)LasVegas2007-09-30
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Bran (author)John Smith2007-09-30

As long as it is low current, you should be fine. I could be wrong, but one inch static electricity sparks are around 15k volts or so, but very low current.

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puffyfluff (author)John Smith2007-11-06

I did some research, and it looks like the voltage increases dramatically, and, as a law of physics, you can't make energy. Therefore, the wattage will stay the same, so the current also reduces dramatically. High voltage won't hurt you, it is high current that will, so you are very safe. How they work is confusing because capacitors are usually used to raise current, but you are right-who cares as long as it works!!!

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John Smith (author)puffyfluff2007-11-06

Well, I got one. It doesn't hurt, only like a carpet static shock.

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mrreno (author)puffyfluff2008-02-20

Somehow my last reply didn't show up. Does anybody know how I would add a small particle collection plate to one of these? Do they need to be elactrically charged or could it be just a small removable sheet of metal? And if it does need to be electrically charged, how would I go about doing that?

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tech-king (author)mrreno2008-02-20

why? there are 2 real types of toroids. plates and needles. plates store the most charge. needles encourage breakout. on devices like ion generators, needles are best.

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mrreno (author)tech-king2008-02-20

The Negative Ion Generator I'm buying, http://www.goldmine-elec-products.com/products.asp?dept=1221, does have needles. What I'm asking is about a dust partcle collection plate mounted underneath the needles. The kind that you can remove and clean, wipe off with a rag. What I was wondering is, does the collection plate have to be electrically charged. I was told that without a collection plate, the dust and dirt would stick to my walls closest to where I have the Ion Generator sitting. I plan on putting a CPU fan with it too.

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tech-king (author)mrreno2008-02-21

no. a plate will absorbe a lot of the negative ions power. you cannot really use a metal one. plexiglass maybe. it probably does not need to be powered.

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mrreno (author)tech-king2008-02-21

Here's an example of one of the articles I read on why a collection plate should be used in this: In this one it says that the collection plate is magnetized?

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mrreno (author)mrreno2008-02-21

I couldn't seem to get the image to load on the last comment so I'll just copy & paste it in this one: (Air Ionizers Prevent "Black Wall") "Air Ionizers prevent the "black wall" effect because the magnetized metal dust collection plates offer a far greater magnetic attraction with the high density of ionized particles nearby the unit. As a result, these particles will collect on the collection plate, and not on other surfaces nearby the air ionizer. In the XJ-3000C, the fan creates airflow to dissipate the negative ions more effectively so there isn’t a large density located at the front of the unit and it also causes airflow and hence it’s particulate to go through the filters and be collected there, not on the surface near the air purifier."

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mrreno (author)mrreno2008-02-21

I read this one again and I was thinking, If it's good for the plates to be magnetized to collect more particles, How could I magnetize them? Could I use 2 small removable metal plates seperated by magnets? (using the magnets as spacers in between the plates). Would this magnetize the plates? Or does the power coming from the needles of the Negative Ion Generator do this by transfering some of power to the plate(s)? Like the plates asorbing power, like tech-king (above), said?

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mrreno (author)mrreno2008-02-21

Back again, I think I may have found the answer to my question while browsing on line. I came across some information on a patent of a Negative Ion Generator and it says that the partcles are electrically charged and collect onto a (Grounded) metal collection plate. So maybe if I just have a grounded plate(s), it should work? Does this sound like it will work? If not, any ideas on how to do this?

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Goodhart (author)mrreno2008-02-21

It is possible, since "gnd" does not necessarily mean "negative". I am familiar with those you speak of ( Oreck sells one... ) and they would either have to be well grounded, or positively charged....and I don;t think anyone wants a positively charged metal plate to be "hot" (carrying current). As you wrote, without this plate (like with my older small models), the dirt sticks to what is near the generator (walls, pictures, etc, and is not easily washed off.

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mrreno (author)Goodhart2008-02-21

So do you think that just grounding the plate(s) would work? It also mentions that they be made from a highly conductive metal. One more question, what kind of easily available metal do you think would be best, or doesn't it really matter.

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Goodhart (author)mrreno2008-02-21

My best guess as to the best of all worlds would be Stainless steel as it would be easy to clean, but that is just a guess. I know with my small plate-less one, the black gunk in the air stuck to the paint on my walls like stains without being very conductive.

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mrreno (author)Goodhart2008-02-29

I have question about these Ion Generators again that you might be able to answer for me. One of them is a (120VAC (7.5kV Output) Negative Ion Generator), and the other is a (12VDC (15kV Output) Negative Ion Generator). Which one of these would be more powerful, giving off the most Negative Ions? One is set at 7.5kV and can operate directly from standard 120VAC, and the other is set at 15kV from 12VDC (and can even operate from a 9V battery at slightly reduced output). I would want to use the one that produces more.

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Goodhart (author)mrreno2008-02-29

Well, to my knowledge, it isn't so much the voltage that makes it put our more ions then another unit. A higher voltage on will definitely tend to create ozone more so then the lower voltage one. It also depends on how they are constructed. The one running off the battery is probably "low amperage", and so, even though the voltage is multiplied to a higher value then the AC unit, it doesn't mean it is more "powerful". I am not even sure I would know "where to look" or whom to ask to find out that information...sorry.

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mrreno (author)Goodhart2008-02-29

I've been looking on Google for the answer but don't really know how to word that question in a search. But I'll keep trying. Thanks!

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Goodhart (author)mrreno2008-03-01

Have you tried more "question" oriented sites like Answer.com ?

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LasVegas (author)mrreno2008-03-01

The voltage isn't going to tell you much about how much it produces. Both 7.5kV and 15kV could supply the same ionization depending on how many plates, how big the plates are and how far they are apart. Your best determination would be the power the device uses (Watts). If they don't supply that information, they should supply the current (Amps) and you can calculate the wattage by the multiplying the voltage (V) by the current (A). Note that 1000 milliamps (mA) = 1 amp (A).

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mrreno (author)Goodhart2008-02-21

Stainless Steel sounds good, easy to get & cheap. Yeah, I read that the dirt and gunk that collects on the walls around them is very hard to remove, like it's electrically charged on it. Thanks for the advice.

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Brennn10 (author)LasVegas2008-03-01

Hey hey Las Vegas! Long time no see!

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John Smith (author)LasVegas2007-09-30

Do you know how they work? From the schematic in the second link (down the page), it seems like an ignition coil type thing.

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Arbitror (author)2010-10-06

Just buy a salt lamp. They are more expensive, but you can really notice the effects. They even look cool, with no cons about them whatsoever.

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The_Canadian (author)2010-07-10

I have read that British hospitals are examining the usage of negative ion generators. Also, apparently they use them in Japan and they are even in lap-top computers.

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captainreliable (author)2010-04-04

What about a 120VAC negative ion generator? Using a lower current?

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petler477 (author)2009-08-26

long story short. I used that same generator to power shoes where the positive was grounded and the hv output was coming into contact with me. it worked perfectly and everything I touched made a spark upon contact. the pain is minimul and not painful. I did hear hear negative ions are healthy too

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Sephuslee (author)petler4772010-01-25

 Hi could you plz tell me were I could purchase one small enuph to fit on my person as I also would like to make the shoes. Thanks.

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petler477 (author)Sephuslee2010-01-25

http://secure.oatleyelectronics.com//advanced_search_result.php?keywords=negative+ion+generator&osCsid=5701a55502853d4867849a58f940a953&x=0&y=0

this is the only place i could find them. btw either one works off a 9-volt battery.

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Sephuslee (author)petler4772010-01-26

 Thankyou for getting back to me.

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mrreno (author)2008-02-20

Does anybody know how you might add an electrically charged dust collection plate to one of these? Would it have to be charged or could you just add a small removable metal plate below the generator? Any kind of help with this would be appreciated. I'm right in the middle of building one & this has got me stumped.

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John Smith (author)2007-09-30

Does anyone know how these work? they seen like mini ignition coils.

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Kinda. I don't really understand how circuits actually work, so my understanding of that page was kinda limited. Anyway, I don't think that it matters how it works, as long as it does work, right? ;D

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Goodhart (author)John Smith2007-11-16

Household ac is run through the coil to drop the voltage to 12 v, then through a bridge to create a DC current. That DC current is applied to a portion of the second coil, while it is also run through the 555 to create a modulated pulse (using the 2 transistors amplifiers), with each "pulse" and subsequent drop, there is a collapse of the coil voltage generating a rather high voltage pulse which is sent to the discharge point (with a HV diode to keep a rebound or lash back from occurring). This, in conjunction with a larger Tesla coil can produce even nastier voltage spikes if one tweaks the 555 a bit. The ozone created however is drawing attention as been more hazardous then helpful.

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Goodhart (author)Goodhart2007-11-16

as been more

should read: as being more

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chooseausername (author)2007-09-30

If it's very low current, then, that should be like "static electricity".

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Goodhart (author)LasVegas2007-09-30

My AC unit, I could place my finger near it and I could hear the crackle but couldn't even feel it.

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Kiteman (author)2007-09-30

If you mean the ones that emit negative ions into the surroundings to improve your health / well-being / mood / whatever, the most beneficial thing they do is slightly increase your electricity bill. The latest health and safety advice (received just this week) says to keep high-voltage emitters at least 2m from your PC, TV, mobile phone or LCD projector, and at least 6m from any electronic medical implant such as pace-makers or insulin pumps. That first sentence of your linked product is pure New Age woowoo. Any benefit felt because of a thunderstorm is down to changing air-pressure and temperature, any cleansing is due to rain-fall and normal winds, not ions.

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John Smith (author)Kiteman2007-09-30

(response to last paragraph) Yeah, I guessed that all that was crap. Anyway, I wanted it for HV, not health, anyway. Yes, I did mean the ones that are used for health, though. Well, the one I linked to, anyway.

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Goodhart (author)John Smith2007-09-30

Well, the one I had that plugged into the wall with a very short cord, certainly took dirt out of the air (and plastered it securely to the white wall behind the stinkin thing). However, new studies show that you are literally creating some "indoor smog". Smog is worsened by Ozone, ionized oxygen.

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