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hey, i am not good at electronics, but heres the idea: i have "planned" an energy saving motor. Anyway there would be a motor, say, driving a bike. The on the wheel's gear we could put another motor, which is for producing electricity. I am not too sure, but i think it produces AC current. But we need DC to drive the first motor (the one moving the bike). So hook up an AC to DC converter to the second motor (the one producing electricity). Then hook some diodes to the wires connecting the first motor from its power source. I think the wires going out from the power source needs diodes, too, since it allows current to flow in one direction (technical term called forward biased? ). To prevent the first motor driving the bike from "burning", a voltage regulator and a current regulator should be needed, right? That's basically the plan. I would be glad to be corrected if i got anything wrong. Thanks.

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Motor 1 drives the bike,
The bike turns motor 2 as a generator,
Motor 2's output runs motor 1.

I think he meant something along the lines of energy reclamation via regenerative braking, I remember being harangued with attacks about perpetual motion every time i suggested that line of idea.

I've worked on perpetual motion before. I determined that the only thing close that a human could make is a gravity mill, like a watermill, but instead using gravity. I've tinkered with the idea, but not recently because I have bigger fish to fry ;)

I thought he just wanted to reclaim energy, much like electric cars rolling down hills, I didn't realize he wanted perpetual motion...

the two ideas you suggested are great! I have re-think the design. it doesn't seem logical because it takes the same amount of energy to generate the first motor, but also drive the second motor. so they both cancel out. but what you suggested is awesome! i should add a "switch" to switch on the second motor-energy generator (link to the first motor or to a cap). it could be used in situations like brakes or going downhills.

You can't have free energy, it'll always use energy, besides if they both took the same energy it would be no use because you couldn't use it for anything, however you can make a very efficient system if you feel inclined to

In this case, it's "free" because he's reclaiming kinetic energy (as electricity) that would otherwise be wasted (as heat in the brakes).

Well, free was a bad word choice, it's free in terms of producing it, I meant more about just appearing energy since the original idea seemed to point toward perpetual motion... I like the idea of regenerative braking but do wonder how well it works, the motors would have to be very high load to the job well...

hmm..theres another way to do this thing, by adding tesla's idea somewhere on the bike. i saw an instructable of a dice randomly rolled by an AVR, powered by a coil and a magnet. you put the magnet inside the coil and shake it to produce electricity. trains back in the old days (where there is a "wooden bar" connecting two wheels) would be a fun idea. and plus, there's less friction (i think).

That's true, I've been thinking that using that for generating AC in petrol generators would be far more efficient as there'd be much less friction involved in converting to rotational motion... You could reclaim alot of power from your bike but you can't keep it going indefinitely, also for the motor regenerative braking it can't have a freewheel mechanism at the back...

Of course, you'd also need a big *battery* to store that energy.

But yes, regenerative braking is one of the ways hybrid or electric vehicles conserve (or rather reuse) a lot of energy.

gravity mill sounds nice. its like trying to pump water out of a fish tank. you use the water pressure so that the water pumps itself out. you dont need to keep pumping it out. nice idea =]

I think that that'd just create more friction

Nice idea. Take it a bit further and reduce friction in the drive train... There is just one more element that will ensure perpetual motion.. Unfortunatley neither you nor I have the answer to that one. I admire your line of thought and encourage you to develope it some more.