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NO2ID Answered

In the recent ID craze, there is both good and bad in allowing ourselves to be "ID'd".
In the UK, some are doing something about it: NO2ID: say NO to ID's

Discussions

If this happens I'll move to cuba!

Hmm, isn't that like jumping from the frying pan into the fire ?

Build a man a fire, keep him warm for a day Set a man on fire, keep him warm for the rest of his life!

ID is ok, but NO RFID IMPLANTS (thats just creepy)

I don't get all the hubbub about RFID in IDs...the way I see it, it's either they swipe my passport at the airport, or they use an RFID reader...not much difference. Same with licenses...

There are some pressure groups with genuine plans to insert "tracking chips" (probably RFID, but possibly active broadcasters instead) chips into children "for their safety".

They get a bit hazy about what age the chips won't be needed any more, so it could be the thin end of a wedge to having a significant slice of the population under 24/7 monitoring.

Normal RFID chips only have ranges of a few feet, but I don't know about the broadcasting chips, and I'm not sure the pressure groups do, it's just part of their grand plan.

I think they may be blurring the edges between RFID and the systems that track the locations of mobile phones by texting them.

Whatever the details, the plan is a worry, especially in a country with a greater level of police/government surveillance than either modern-day China or the old USSR.

Even at a few feet, someone can "read your chip" standing behind you in a queue at the grocer's with a hand held reader.

Great Guthix! I refuse to allow myself to be tagged in such a manner...

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VIRON

10 years ago

This has been prophesied in the bible as 666 and the mark of the beast without which you will not be able to buy or sell, and may be killed! If you accept it, you are doomed. Revelation 13. Why the mark of the beast? Animals are already tagged this way. What other thing could go in your HAND to fulfill the prophecy? It's a prophecy, a sure sign it's going to happen. Just try and stop it, but Get Ready; It's happening NOW!

Even among those of us that take note of this, there are some that understand the link with Daniel, and therefor, the number, which is not six-hundred-and-sixty-six, but rather 6 . 6 . 6 refers to the end of the Third age of mankind. Those unable to "enter into my rest" or Shabbat (seventh). It's significance may not be as most understand it then.

Or, 600+(20x3)+6. (Threescore); "the NUMBER of the beast". Nevertheless, I am a master of machines, not a slave. And I am also a master of animals, without a brand, collar, or leash. Which animal or organization should brand me? Who's my master? Daniel's "beasts" are nations. Sodom demanded to know strangers immediately before its doom. Thereby likewise the "beast" is advised to mind it's own business!

Or, 600+(20x3)+6. (Threescore); "the NUMBER of the beast".

Not in the Greek, only in English does it appear that way. In the Greek it is 6 beside another 6 beside a third 6 (notice all the "1/3's in Rev." and you get the idea.

Greek numbers were letters and there were 3 different letters, one for 600, one for 60, and one for 6. Just like in the Latin, they used DCLXVI, not VI VI VI.

only in numerology it is also the subject of many interpretations of the 3 6's .

The Greek alphabet (Chi intermediate between the 5 th(Abba) and 6 th(áAbel) ), used as numbers; what is interesting is this phrase that gets ignored quite often: "the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man. " The number has always been, 6. The curse has always been: "they shall never enter into my rest."

The number of one man, the number of each member of mankind, or the number of the antichrist(s)? Who are the cursed "they" and what is "my rest"? I'll assume peace. If elite stranger is always watching marked stranger, is there peace? If everyone is of equal status watching each other's chips, is there peace then? Terrorist enemies may be among the chip watchers either way, since they may be elite, proletarians, or equals. Most sneaky is the chip activated bomb. RFID is false security. It's also nosey. Also, who wants a permanent record? No hope of being forgiven for anything. Being marked at birth with "your share" of the world's debt. Unless you're elite; then you can push Delete! Even if it's not THE damned mark, RFID is Orwellian Soviet Dystopia.

The number of one man

You seem to be getting upset over this conversation and that is not my purpose. I have looked at this thing for over 3 decades and it all fits a pattern most will not consider, but I don't want to force anything on you either. Let me just say this then in reference to the quote I start with: it is "as in ADAM all die, that is everyone. The number of mankind is 6, an end before Shabbot, and an end without entrance into Olam Ha-Ba, the world to com, the "rest".

Being marked at birth

If you reside in the USA, you are marked from birth, it is called a Social Security number. It links to everything about you. Loose it, and you loose your identity, someone else can take it with the greatest of ease. We just add to that horror with each new device...

I'm calm, and interested. I used the word "damned" only literally. Rev 14:9-11 The curse of the marked. I'm curious, what is your hypothesis on how to "enter his rest"?

What did Jesus say? When asked what the greatest law was, he answered: Love the Lord your God with all your heart, and the second is just like it (the way you do this), love your neighbor as though he were you. On these two stand all the laws and the prophets. Do this and you will live. As is written in another place, for he was "an example" for us. We each, like bowlers and golfers, have individual handicaps that do not allow us perfection, but if we do our best with the cards we have been dealt, are are following the Chief example given us to follow. This is how one enters Olam ha-ba

Ok, I know that. Thanks. But I believe that those who want ID generally hate their 'neighbors', and are waiting to accuse them of a crime.

Those looking for Total ID centralized repository of information, want control....step out of line and the "man" comes down on you hard. :-) It is human nature to want to point at others or other things to blame for one's own inadequacies, sadly. Or they want someone else to "do it for them" many times. Both sad conditions.

well, you enter into the tiger's cage or the polar bear's lair unarmed. The master of beasts is the one that masters the beast within.

Ok, so just avoid 666 on the national ID cards, and we should be good, right? If all US hotels can manage to avoid having a 13th floor, checking for any potentially offensive/superstitious number sequences in the ID's should be trivial.

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Patrik

10 years ago

Bruce Schneier, computer security guru extraordinaire, and a person whose opinion I respect greatly, has some excellent criticisms of US ID cards, and the Real ID act. Here's some more pages by him on this issue:

Schneier on Security: REAL ID
Identification and Security
National ID Cards

Now, after this ringing endorsement, I have to admit that I'm somewhat puzzled by all this hubbub about a national ID card in the US (and the UK as well, it seems). Having grown up in Belgium, where everybody has an ID card, I just don't see what the fuss is. Besides, the US already has ID cards anyway! Sure, you call them "drivers licenses", but how often do you use them for entirely non-driving related purposes? And sure, there's different ID cards - sorry - drivers licenses for each state, but that only makes them even less secure and easier to forge.

I do agree with Schneier's analysis that it would be foolish to rely solely on an ID card. But a nationally standardized ID card with some serious security measures built-in would be a heck of a lot better than what the US has now.

As for RFID - Schneier has some excellent points on those as well. I'm not going to rehash that here. Suffice it to say that at the very least, the current RFID systems have all the security of a brown paper bag. No wait - that's not fair against brown paper bags - all the security of a piece of tissue paper?

RF tags have some great applications, but in the current implementations, they should not be used to verify anybody's identity, nor should they be holding any sensitive information (like your passport data!)

One comment for now:

some serious security measures built-in

In some respects, this is the problem. No matter whom we pick to hand over our information to, the more info that is in "one repository" the less secure it is. And the greater the chance for those that hold sway over that repository to abuse the privilege of having it under their control in the first place.

I personally do not like the "trend" more so than the positive aspects of this trek we have started on.

Interestly enough I haven't seen much of this big ID craze only the garage around the corner has changed but that's more due to re-opening which means they're checked up on to make sure they're keeping to the law. Strangely they all know me and i buy cigarettes in there alot, thus they know I am over the age, I fill up my petrol tank for the strimmer and grab some two stroke oil and they asked me for I.D. (the legal age to buy petrol does exist and is 16 as are cigarettes) and I got confused... On the other side of things I'm 17 and drink, I never get hit for I.D. in bars or off licences, even the one where at least one of them knows I'm not 18... Though in my shop getting a reund involves filling in a form including your home adress, granted I could find that from an electricity top up card number which is printed on the paypoint receipt I can duplicate at any time, paranoia or what?

Where do these chips go exactly? Better not be were I'am thinking!