"So what are my options?"
1.Fix it at a TV repair shop
Calls to television repair shops produced a range of estimates, i.e. $300 for an on-site consultation and no guarantee of repair. Shipping or transporting the TV to a repair shop could could add insult to injury as it is quite large and might be damaged even further during shipping.
2.Buy a new TV
With new plasma TVs costing about $1000+ for a similar model, it's a tough call between getting the old one fixed or just purchasing a new one. If repairs are more than $500, you'd be better off just chucking the old one and buying new. Since the Dell wasn't smoking or on fire and looked like it was still in very good condition, throwing it away seemed like a waste.
3.Take it apart
While my buddy contemplated what he wanted to do (see options 1 and 2 above), I resolved to just take the dang thing apart to see what I could see. I'm fairly electronics savvy and I love taking things apart, so this was an opportunity not to be missed.
The Bottom Line
Long story short, a $1.09 part took down a $4000 television.
Disclaimer:
The information contained herein is only a journal of my experiences. It is not meant as a tutorial for someone else to fix their own TV. If you use it as such, you do so at your own risk. Don't blame me if you destroy your TV or get hurt in the process. With that said, please continue reading....
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Signing UpStep 1: Symptoms
2. TV still powers up, blue led lights up, and relays click at turn on
3. Sound still works
4. Picture may come back for hours at a time but not reliably
5. Picture may appear for a split second when turning off.
How it happened
It all started one day when I went to turn on the TV and, while the power LED lit up and the power relays clicked as usual, the screen was blank. I thought it was on the wrong input so I used the controller to switch inputs but the on-screen menu would not show up either. The sound, however, was working so it was definitely on the right input already. I left the TV on for a while and after a couple minutes, the picture magically appeared! Great, it just needed to warm up I thought. After being left on for a couple of hours however, the screen went dark again. The TV was basically unusable because turning on the TV would usually result in just a dark, blank screen. Since the sound continued to work, I suspected something to do with the power supplied to the plasma screen proper.








































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I am going to open her up either tonight or tomorrow, depending on how crazy my kids are acting..lol! Once I get a better picture of what I am dealing with, I will post again. I am thinking, after reading your very in-depth and intelligent Instructable here, I am not making a move without checking with you! Lol!
Thank you for your time and you are doing an OUTSTANDING job here!
I bought my Dell W5001C brand new from the Dell site and when it was delivered, I was like a kid again. Then 1 year later, almost to the day, and of course the warranty had expired, it went out. All the symptoms explained above. No screen but sound, blue power LED was lit. I would turn it on, it would give the audible click and then almost immediately another click. I thought it might be one of the power relay switches, but, after paying $5000.00 for this thing, I wasn't about to attempt it myself.
I called Dell and of course they wanted the thing shipped to them via insured courier to their buildings in the Bay Area of California. All at my expense, mind you. Then I would have to pay a large fee for just looking at it, to be followed up with the repair and replacement of any parts, etc., etc.
After looking into doing as they asked, it would have cost me in the neighborhood of $1300.00. Just to have them look at it.
I quickly packed the thing back into its box and stored it away. For almost 3 years.
I saw an ad in eBay for the repair of my TV for $150.00 one day and got all excited again. The draw back was that I would have to disassemble all of the boards from the TV and send them to this guy in San Jose, California. After 3 years, I thought..."Well ...It's already broken, what could I possibly do to it?"
No... I didn't hurt anything.
He sent the boards back to me about 4 days later and I reassembled the TV... and it worked beautifully.
For almost 1 year EXACTLY to the day.
Now the same problem.
When I got the boards back, I looked real close to what might have been replaced. The only thing I could see was that he had replaced 3 or 4 capacitors on the main PCB.
I am going to attempt this on my own this time, but, I am really hoping that this is not a dead thread just in case I need some backup.
Are you game, mr12volt??
By the way my buddy's TV is still going strong.
Interesting thread and very informative, hopefully I can generate some more information on Dell W4200HD I am diagnosing.
I have checked for swollen caps, and although none are obvious, needless to say, they could still be bad with age.
It appears the same symptoms can be caused by more than one bad component. And it looks like one bad voltage will create same symptoms, so here is what I am seeing.
When I turn on TV, the red LED comes on after the power up clicks in about five seconds or so, and this is consistent. I had sound go out first, then picture died, let it sit overnight, tried again, still no sound, and picture lasted for about five hours, then poof, nothing. I did run plasma conditioning for about five hours when I still had picture since a few areas of red and blue pixels were starting to shadow the lower left bottom with about a two inch area which you only noticed on white back screen.
So here is what I have checked so far. Went through all the voltages, plugged in and TV off, and then turning TV on. I had VS 170V, VCC 15V, DSVL 5.2V, D3V3 3.45V, VSCAN 55.3V which is lower than 70V I believe it should be? But here is the killer, VE is 0V ???? Any ideas what to check and does the missing VE impact the low VSCAN voltage.
Thanks,
Turned on the TV last week and no Dell logo splash screen or any other video. No audio either. After a couple of tries, the set came on and worked for a few days. Did this again a few days later. Finally the picture and audio died while watching it. The set also didn't respond to the remote (power on/off).
Thanks to this great instructable, I learned to check the voltages on the power supply. All were within specs except the 5v which measured at 3.0v - 3.5v.
I didn't think that the 5v being off would cause the loss of video, but could explain the lack of response to the remote by the logic circuitry.
After reading this: http://blog.coppelltvrepair.com/2010/10/dell-w4201c-hd-powers-on-off-no-picture.html
...I checked the two 2200uF 10v caps shown at this link. They were bulged at the top, and looked to be part of the 5v circuit.
Spent under $3 to replace the two capacitors. Set fixed!
So I thought I had the same problem with my tv as the one you described, however after replacing the ic I still experience problems. At first I thought it was working correctly however I think it must have been a coincidence. Ive checked the voltages and everything seems good except the 5v. After having the tv unplugged I read from around 3.5V all the way to 4.1V. The tv seems to work if the voltage does build up over 4.2 as sometimes it does. For the most part it doesn't seem to buildup from 3.5V to 4.2V. On pin 8 of U661 i read 4.98V which I believe is correct as Vref of the IC is suppose to be 5V after reading the datasheet on the uc2843. I had originally swapped out U501, and I ordered 2 extra IC's as they are only 1.23 cdn. So U501 and U661 both have UC2843B in them rather than the orignal KA3883's. ZD611 reads the exact same as the 5V output (after buildup stays around 4V) so I believe they are electrically connected, although I have not traced out the PCB. Would you think that the zener is bad? possibly pulling the 5v down to 4V? Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated, I don't have an isolation transformer to work with here only a DMM. I do know electronics, however without a schematic of this I'm finding it very difficult to troubleshoot. Thank you very much for the instructable, very well written.
First of all, please check back with us if you ever work out the problem. I don't think I can be of too much help since I don't have a schematic either. BUT! You have something almost as good as the schematic, the board itself! The board is only two layers so tracing the circuit isn't too bad. Use the DMM on continuity mode to track down traces that disappear under large components. Gradually you'll be able to build up enough of a schematic to figure out the topology of the 5V circuit. If you know electronics, you should be able to tell roughly what is a resistor, capacitor, transformer, diode, and MOSFET switch. The board is very well marked by its silkscreen and most of the symbols are pretty much there for you. They're even marked on the backside too! Brilliant.
I'm kinda curious about the 5V and 3V circuits myself. I never looked closely at the digital logic voltages because that wasn't my problem at the time but now I wish I had. Many people seem to experience problems with them. I'd like to know the type of switching regulators used to produce 5V and 3V , if they work off the ~400V rail just after the diode bridge or the +17V DC rail, which IC is the control IC for them, and if they are normally powered when the digital board is not plugged in to the power supply.
Lastly, which 5V rail are you having problems with, the D5V or 5Vstb?
Also did you have to pull the board into which the Y-buffer card is plugged in order to remove it? Seems to be a post in the way preventing me from unplugging it from the larger board.
I have no picture, but power light in power button lights and relays click. Unit doesn't shut itself off. Green LEDs on PCBs are on solid. All PS voltages are close with my old analog multimeter.
Thanks!
Hi. I have a Dell-W5001C-50 and i believe it has this same problem. Powers on, blue LED on, relays click. I don't have the expertise to resolve and travel 75% of the time so it's tough to repair.
I'm open to a good deal. Make me an offer? No shipping. pickup only SF Bay Area, CA.
bk
My issues is close, but after 5 mins or so my picture comes up. i tested the VAs and a few of those, and they seem fine. Do you still think it could be the 501 chip?
You worked on a dell 50inch I have a dell 42 inch with much of the same symptoms.
For two weeks the TV would work good all day long, turn off, turn on, good picture
But my wife would wake me up in the morning with ( The TV won't turn on) I'd get up and mess with it. then unplug it, and plug it in. and it would them turn on and work all day alright. Then one day no more TV, The lights were on but the Walton's won't home. I'm not as good as you in electronics. But I do solder and de-solder with what I have, I diagnosis with guess work, sometimes I get it right, sometimes no. there are many similarities with the 50 and the 42 But the the power board maybe a little different from what I can see by your pic's Do you thank that the chip you replaced cloud be the same? if there is an U501 in the 42 would it be the same? do the symptoms sound the same to you? Give me a little help if you would.
Thanks
Lyn
Your television's symptoms sound similar so this could very well be the same problem. It's possible that the power supply will have the same reference designators for it's components so look for U501 first. If nothing matches, look at all the DIP parts to see if there is one with 8 pins that reads "KA3883". There won't be too many DIP parts. Use a flashlight and magnifying glass if the printing on the chips is hard to read. If you find a match and are up to the challenge, I say go for it.
After reading your reply, I removed the back for the first time. I have just one more question before entering the Lions Den. My power board is the same shape as yours but thats where similarity ends. The components are so many you can't even see the board. and the arrangement of these Components defer from the 50 inch.
in all ways. except for one! There is only one 8 pin IC on the entire board It is marked as IC8003 The chip it self has K436 TOP223PN 30309C This chip is in the Exact spot as your KA3883 And this is a Samsung board.
So My Question is! (Do you think? Could it be?) Await your reply
Thanks
Lyn
http://www.powerint.com/sites/default/files/product-docs/top221-227.pdf
It is NOT interchangable. Since the power supply board is so different, this isn't likely to be the same problem. That doesn't mean you should give up though! If you know how to use a multimeter, probe the output voltages on the power supply when the TV is acting up and try to find one that is out of spec. My TV's power supply listed all the output voltages and the acceptable range for those voltages on the silkscreen near the bottom edge of the circuit board. Be careful when the TV is turned on though, there are some *shocking* voltages inside! The way I did it was to set up the multimeter probes with the TV turned off and then I turned the TV on with the remote, read the multimeter, then turned the TV off and moved the probe to the next voltage I wanted to read. This way you don't touch anything when power is applied.
Thanks!
Help Please
This BEAST is on the wall and what 200 pounds. So i stuffed my self up against the wall, got photos. I see that tag that says w5001c. but the other Service Tags are the same.
Why would dell tell me its a w4201 when its a 50" ? Just some Dell Scam?
So my problems. (well i had the issues before where no picture but sound, and picture would freeze. So Dell replace this about a month or two before the warranty ran out. that was about 2 years ago.)
My issues, i turn it on and it takes literally a minute or two before it boots up, before picture or inputs is on. The blue light comes on, but just takes forever for image to appear or sound.
Once picture is on, everything is fine. But once i turn off, turn back on it will take a minute or two to come back. Seems like its getting a little worse day by day.
So do you think going through your journal might be a good place to start?
Thanks
Kevin
kevin697788(AT) Yahoo.com