how can find longitude and latitude using omni antenna? how many antenna we need?

Can we find longitude and latitude of a mobile user in cellular network using Omni Antenna? if you can how many antenna we need?. or we need to use GPS services?



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iceng4 years ago
idevices use the time distance between three cells to arrive at your estimated position.
Not real GPS I believe.
m2sharief (author)  iceng4 years ago
three cells or a cell contains three antenna?
iceng4 years ago
The gps ( global positioning system ) needs a minimum of 3 satellites
to place you on the globe, 4 if you want altitude.

Mostimes it can bring in 8 near satellites and 15 in Nevada clear deserts.

GPS can give your speed walking, driving or skiing down a mountain.

A
m2sharief (author)  iceng4 years ago
Many thanks
In Mobile Device such as Iphone, etc there is GPS services. is it real GPS or it is a service through the network? i mean is the mobile contained GPS's hardware? Meanwhile, if he has a hardware why GPS in the mobile device does not work when there is no internet connection?
It sounds like your trying to find the location of a cell phone signal using your own radio antenna!?

You wouldn't be able to focus in on the specific cell phones signal to track it. You could probably get the right frequency dialed in but then you would have to find a way to filer out hundreds of other devices on that same frequency.

Now lets say you are trying to track a basic radio transmitter that is easily tracked with a directional receiver. Like those radio trackers used for tracking animals in the wild. You would need at least 3 people with the receivers spread out in the outer perimeter of the area you believe the signal is coming from. Each person would need a GPS and you would need someone coordinating all the data. Each person would report to the coordinator there lat and long as well as the compass bearing they are hearing the transmitter at. Coordinator can then mark the position on the map and draw a line in the direction reported. With all 3 positions reported the lines should intersect somewhere on the map giving you a general area where the transmission is coming from. The more receivers you have out there the more accurate your positioning can be.

So what are you trying to accomplish here?
m2sharief (author)  mpilchfamily4 years ago
Many Thanks. The Node B(Base Station) in cellular communication network use many types of antenna. I am wondering i the NodeB's antenna is Omni antenna, so can the Node B provide me the longitude and latitude of a mobile user?
frollard4 years ago
You cannot pinpoint the location of a specific cel phone with radio:

Cel phones use frequency hopping for the last decade -- they are constantly changing channels tens or hundreds of times per second to reduce interference. The cel phone companies can triangulate a signal but only because they know the locations of their cel towers, which antenna (they are not omni, they are directional, generally 3+ per tower)...and by hitting multiple towers at multiple signal strengths (root mean squared power/distance ratio) means they can guesstimate within a few hundred meters where a cel phone is, but you, as an end user, without access to their encrypted radio network...cannot.
They can get a LOT closer than "a few hundred metres".
I work emergency phone lines - 911 (999 etc)...

We get the caller's cel phone location one of two ways:
the cel location reported BY the phone gps, as close as 2 meters uncertainty...90% confidence.
When the phone doesn't get a gps fix, we get the best known location from the phone towers, and it's NEVER better than 150 meter radius. The numbers I generally get are 300-25,000 meter radius.
Granted, that's the best the phone company can do in 30 seconds before the location packet is delivered. With a specific, targeted location calculation they could do a bit better, but not much.
Maybe the antenna density is higher here, or they are using more modern protocols, but our error circles are nearer 50-75 metres,
I would figuratively kill for data like that...even in our dense metro areas with massive tower coverage we don't get figures like that :(
iceng frollard4 years ago
I live within a rocks throw of a cell tower and can tell position changes
from deck door to main door :-)
frollard iceng4 years ago
and that's probably inertial systems in the phone in conjunction with known gps coordinates. Turn your gps off and see how good that fix is. It has nothing to do with the cel tower.
iceng frollard4 years ago
I would tend to think the closer to a tower the better the accuracy
Cell tower software has in determining my relative position.

I will try what you suggest next warm day.
frollard iceng4 years ago
closer to a point - best accuracy would be equidistant from a bunch of towers so they all got a strong signal and you could place the source 'equal' to all the towers. Right next to one tower means you're the furthest from the others and they'd have a harder time placing the other intersecting circles.
m2sharief (author)  frollard4 years ago
Many thanks.

Is OmniDirection antenna worked? or just just direction antenna?
iceng4 years ago
Each cell tower knows how far away your iPhone is from its position.
Three cell towers can and do triangulate to figure where you actually are.
Then the system tells you your position.
frollard iceng4 years ago
A tower cannot place distance, it can place signal strength, which is totally useless until you have signal strength from multiple sources...then it can begin to deduce a ratio of the distances from the towers based on the proportions of the signal strength.
iceng frollard4 years ago
Maybe that's why it takes longer to place me then my hand GPS.
frollard iceng4 years ago
potentially; it's a lot more rare for a handset to actually calculate its own location with cel towers, only for the towers to calculate (as a system) the location of the handset. Getting a slow gps fix on a phone is simply a function of phones having very small and low-power gps modules for that everpresent battery life overhead.
For some reason the reply buttons are not showing up for me...

Anyway...

Phones like the iPhone do have an actual GPS receiver in them you just need a GPS app to take full advantage of it. But the phone uses a combination of the GPS and it's triangulated position based on the surrounding cell towers for it's built in maps app. If the phone is in a WI-Fi area it can access a database of known wifi nodes and there proximate locations to also help figure out where you are on the maps app.

A single bay station can not give you lat and long. It is a single point it what needs to be 3 or more points to triangulate a position. Not to mention the bay station has no way of knowing where it is at.
I had no reply buttons 11 hrs ago when that happened to me.