New Casio fx9860 GIII model

10042020, 07:26 PM
Post: #41




RE: New Casio fx9860 GIII model
(10042020 04:53 PM)grsbanks Wrote: Using a python program it does it in only 2 seconds for \(n=10^3\), 18 seconds for \(n=10^4\) or 184 seconds for \(n=10^5\). That's 10× faster than using Casio Basic, BUT with what appears to be greatly reduced precision. Does the Python program use singleprecision floats, and if so does the Casio implementation of Python have doubles? 

10042020, 08:45 PM
Post: #42




RE: New Casio fx9860 GIII model
It should also be noted that KhiCAS is now available on the Casio Fx9750GIII (thank you Parisse!) giving it a CAS that is similar to the one in the HP Prime (same Xcas engine). This makes the Casio Fx9750GIII the lowest priced currently produced graphing calculator with Micro Python and CAS capabilities. Very impressive for under US$42 new.
https://www.cemetech.net/forum/viewtopic...783#286192 

10042020, 11:34 PM
Post: #43




RE: New Casio fx9860 GIII model
When I tried the KhiCAS on Parrisse’s site... on the graphing application, it was surprisingly fast, but, upon inspection, appeared to use much fewer sampling points it it’s plot. Perhaps there is a way to use a denser setting for the graphing...


10052020, 07:30 AM
Post: #44




RE: New Casio fx9860 GIII model
(10042020 07:26 PM)John Keith Wrote: Does the Python program use singleprecision floats, and if so does the Casio implementation of Python have doubles? That I don't know. I only looked at Python for the first time this weekend so that I could run these tests so I wouldn't really know where to look. This said, the manual makes no mention of single or double precision and it _is_ a pretty stripped down version of Python, so I wouldn't be surprised if it doesn't "do" double precision. There are only 10 types of people in this world. Those who understand binary and those who don't. 

10052020, 10:57 AM
Post: #45




RE: New Casio fx9860 GIII model
Python uses binary floats, rather than the BCD that is presumably used in all the other modes, so that could contribute to the speed. Not sure if the CPU has any floating point instructions included.


10052020, 12:25 PM
Post: #46




RE: New Casio fx9860 GIII model
(10042020 04:53 PM)grsbanks Wrote: Has anyone else noticed how damn fast this thing is using python? Would you post the exact program you used to test? For a valid benchmark, the same program should be used on all the tested calculators (or as close as possible). Here's the nqueens program I used: Code: def nqueens(): Tom L Cui bono? 

10052020, 04:13 PM
Post: #47




RE: New Casio fx9860 GIII model
(10052020 12:25 PM)toml_12953 Wrote: Would you post the exact program you used to test? For a valid benchmark, the same program should be used on all the tested calculators (or as close as possible). Here's the nqueens program I used: Sure. FWIW I think yours stops at the first solution found. Mine starts by asking what size board you want to work with and then finds all the solutions (92 in the case of an 8×8 board) Code: n=0 There are only 10 types of people in this world. Those who understand binary and those who don't. 

10052020, 06:02 PM
Post: #48




RE: New Casio fx9860 GIII model
(10042020 07:26 PM)John Keith Wrote:(10042020 04:53 PM)grsbanks Wrote: Using a python program it does it in only 2 seconds for \(n=10^3\), 18 seconds for \(n=10^4\) or 184 seconds for \(n=10^5\). That's 10× faster than using Casio Basic, BUT with what appears to be greatly reduced precision. I would be surprised if Casio picked singleprecision float for its Python implementation. With only 7 digits precision (and greatly reduced exponent range), that is just asking for user complaints. More likely, what appeared to be reduced precision is just default display format of numbers. To get a good reference of what is expected, I simplified the formula: Σ (e^sin(atan(x)))^(1/3) = Σ e^(x/(sqrt(9*x*x+9)) All terms about the same size, approaching e^(1/3) ≈ 1.39561 when x is big To reduce errors, break up the sum to its integer and fractional parts. Code: expm1 = require'mathx'.expm1 lua> sum(1e3) 1395 0.34628774342325536 lua> sum(1e4) 13955 0.8579042915289953 lua> sum(1e5) 139560 0.9761411065516028 Binary math tends to be more accurate, because of smaller accumulated rounding errors. 

10052020, 10:08 PM
Post: #49




RE: New Casio fx9860 GIII model
(10042020 07:26 PM)John Keith Wrote:(10042020 04:53 PM)grsbanks Wrote: Using a python program it does it in only 2 seconds for \(n=10^3\), 18 seconds for \(n=10^4\) or 184 seconds for \(n=10^5\). That's 10× faster than using Casio Basic, BUT with what appears to be greatly reduced precision. Assuming it's the same implementation as on the fxCG50, it's using IEEE754 double precision: Code: >>>1+1e151 — Ian Abbott 

10052020, 10:27 PM
(This post was last modified: 10052020 10:30 PM by ijabbott.)
Post: #50




RE: New Casio fx9860 GIII model
(10042020 08:45 PM)Steve Simpkin Wrote: It should also be noted that KhiCAS is now available on the Casio Fx9750GIII (thank you Parisse!) giving it a CAS that is similar to the one in the HP Prime (same Xcas engine). This makes the Casio Fx9750GIII the lowest priced currently produced graphing calculator with Micro Python and CAS capabilities. Very impressive for under US$42 new. It's more than twice that price here in the UK (for the moreorless equivalent fx9860GIII model), and more than 70% of the price of an fxCG50, so not quite the bargain it is in the USA! — Ian Abbott 

10062020, 08:26 PM
Post: #51




RE: New Casio fx9860 GIII model
the cg50 with micropython got around 57 seconds for 100k
https://www.hpmuseum.org/forum/thread97...#pid103448 Wikis are great, Contribute :) 

10112020, 05:45 PM
Post: #52




RE: New Casio fx9860 GIII model
In the United States, the fx9860GIII is named the fx9750GIII, both in black and white.


10112020, 06:29 PM
Post: #53




RE: New Casio fx9860 GIII model
(10112020 05:45 PM)Eddie W. Shore Wrote: In the United States, the fx9860GIII is named the fx9750GIII, both in black and white. In my country (Czechia) Casio sells both the lines (9750G and 9860G). 9860G is positioned higher  higher price, more capabilities. For example compatibility with Data Logger (https://edu.casio.com/support/datalogger/en/) seems to be one of the differences. Disclaimer: No personal experience, just glanced at local web pages... 

10112020, 10:08 PM
(This post was last modified: 10112020 11:43 PM by Steve Simpkin.)
Post: #54




RE: New Casio fx9860 GIII model
(10112020 06:29 PM)vaklaff Wrote:(10112020 05:45 PM)Eddie W. Shore Wrote: In the United States, the fx9860GIII is named the fx9750GIII, both in black and white. That was true of the previous generation models (fx9860GII and fx9750GII) where the fx9750GII lacked a number of features. With those models, the fx9750GII lacked the following features that were present in the fx9860GII: * Flash memory * Vector calculations * eActivity * Spreadsheet * Natural textbook display (Math Input/Output Mode) * Examination Mode * ECON3 Data Logger (9750GII had ECON2) * Scientific constants & Periodic Table (Physium) * Geometry Application Theses functions were all added to the new fx9750GIII along with Python. There is virtually no difference between the fx9860GIII and fx9750GIII models now. They both now support USB Mass Storage mode as well. As I mentioned previously, KhiCAS is now available on the Casio Fx9750GIII (thank you Parisse!) giving it a CAS that is similar to the one in the HP Prime (same Xcas engine). The Fx9750GIII currently sells for under US$42 in the U.S. It seems the equivalent fx9860GIII is priced much higher in Europe. I suspect its low price in the U.S is to help compete against the permanently entrenched TI84 Plus which sells for almost 3 times as much in the U.S. 

10122020, 06:59 AM
Post: #55




RE: New Casio fx9860 GIII model
(10112020 10:08 PM)Steve Simpkin Wrote: The Fx9750GIII currently sells for under US$42 in the U.S. It seems the equivalent fx9860GIII is priced much higher in Europe. I suspect its low price in the U.S is to help compete against the permanently entrenched TI84 Plus which sells for almost 3 times as much in the U.S. The fx9860GIII sells in the UK for prices ranging from £70 ($90) to about £100 ($130) depending on where you look. I have not yet seen an fx9750GIII over here but that's to be expected if, unlike the fx9750GII, that model only targets North America. The low price in the US probably is an attempt to dethrone the TI84 Plus. Over here, it's Casio that has a stronghold on the education market, not TI, so they see no reason to price the unit more attractively. There are only 10 types of people in this world. Those who understand binary and those who don't. 

10132020, 11:39 AM
Post: #56




RE: New Casio fx9860 GIII model
(10042020 07:26 PM)John Keith Wrote:(10042020 04:53 PM)grsbanks Wrote: Using a python program it does it in only 2 seconds for \(n=10^3\), 18 seconds for \(n=10^4\) or 184 seconds for \(n=10^5\). That's 10× faster than using Casio Basic, BUT with what appears to be greatly reduced precision. The CG50 model does. I don't know about the others although I would figure they used the same Python across calculators. Tom L Cui bono? 

10152020, 03:43 PM
Post: #57




RE: New Casio fx9860 GIII model
Is there a difference in available functions on the 7500 giii/9800 giii vs the fxCG50? The previous CASIO’s (including the fxCG50) seem to have difficulties in integrations that involve a range that includes an undefined/infinite value. The TI 36X Pro does better in this regard. Has this been solved in the iii series?


10162020, 08:22 PM
(This post was last modified: 10172020 11:34 AM by Csaba Tizedes.)
Post: #58




RE: New Casio fx9860 GIII model
Just one question: it can numerically differentiate only by variable 'x' or by any?
EDIT: Yes, as I guess before: there is no any update in the software. What CASIO want with this OS? For educational purposes, the CASIO is failed. I can't understand, how the CASIO think that their calculators will be used in education?! Eg. in the high school how do you want to perform a local extremum find on a plane without differentiation by any variable (at least x AND y)? Nonsense. Useless. Waste of money. Csaba 

10182020, 11:26 PM
Post: #59




RE: New Casio fx9860 GIII model
A neat thing about the TI 36X Pro is that one has max and a min capability to apply...one, for example could integrate from point A to point B, Max((f(x),g(x))).


10212020, 12:47 AM
Post: #60




RE: New Casio fx9860 GIII model
My fx9750GIII came in the mail today, and it's really impressive! The Python implementation seems to work really well. The manual says the editor can only handle files with up to 150 lines, though it can execute files larger than that. This is kind of annoying but not a dealbreaker. The latest OS update adds the casioplot module so you can use graphics from Python. I also read that the calculator uses the same processor as the Prizm, so it runs at 58MHz instead of 29MHz like the g and gii models. The spreadsheet mode and eactivity mode, which seems to be like a Jupyter notebook, are also really neat. They probably aren't news to most people but this is the first new Casio I've gotten since the AFX 2.0+
One thing I have not figured out is how to open a text file from Python. The "open" command is supported but returns "NoneType" since I'm probably missing the path for the file I'm trying to open. Anyone know how to do it? Another thing that would be interesting is inlining assembly, which MicroPython supports with a decorator: 10. Inline assembler. The calculator recognizes @micropython as a decorator, but I couldn't get it to recognize .asm or .asm_sh4. With a limit of 150 lines, you couldn't write much assembly, but it might be enough to jump into a library written in C and designed to be called from Python. 

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